F60L Recent pics

[Tony Wheeler]

Here's an interesting background - woodgrain!

THE FORMATION SIGN OF 2ND DIVISION AIF, DURING THE 1939-45 WAR. THE SIGN WAS REPRODUCED IN WHITE ON A BLACK SQUARE. THE PHOTOGRAPH SHOWS THE SIGN REPRODUCED ON A PIECE OF FURNITURE IN THE POSSESSION OF THE DIVISIONAL COMMANDER AND WAS TAKEN AFTER THE WAR TO SHOW HOW THE SIGN HAD BEEN RENDERED.

[Tony Wheeler]

I notice the AWM have an original 2nd Div vehicle:

"This vehicle was used by the Australian Army during the Second World War. It served at least part of its career with the Second Australian Infantry Division and in Western Command."

Penguin is on yellow background here.

[Mike Cecil]

I don't fully remember the circumstances of the formation sign on that truck ... it is a long time ago that it was purchased from a Victorian enthusiast. The truck was in Castlemaine as the 'spare' at a factory before he purchased and restored it including a repaint. After several years driving, he agreed to selling it to the AWM. I seem to remember that there were remains of the formation sign that he then reproduced.

The canvas is also an original WW2 canopy that came with it when he bought it, although I think marked to another truck type.

Nice, original truck with a low mileage. It was a very worthwhile acquisition.

Mike C

[Ganmain Tony]

Now that truck is interesting...

Begs the question, what would go into the TAC sign holder?

The one attached to the front that appears to be off a Cab 13?

[Keith Webb]

Here's one of the cab 12 I took out at Mitchell several years ago.

[Mike Cecil]

Actually, the Unit sign should go in the 'tac sign holder', and they are the same holder for both Aust cab 12 and 13. The plate with the unit sign was reversible: it was supposed to have the word 'PASS' on the back, to be displayed when the vehicle was stopped on the side of the road and was NOT in need of assistance.

Dave placed an artillery Unit sign of his choice on the right guard, which was a common position, but the regs actually say that both signs at the front should be on the left side.

Technically, the bridge sign on B vehs should be in an irregularly shaped yellow area approximating 8 inches in diameter, but there again, were often simply circular.

There are some complexities, but that's basically how it was supposed to work (except for the good ole AIF(ME), who amalgamated the Unit & Formation signs onto a single sign in early 1942).

Regarding overseas vehicle deliveries into an Australian Port, prior to a ship's arrival with a known vehicle cargo, an assembly contract was raised with an appropriate assembler most often in the region of the port of delivery. (ie deliveries into Port of Brisbane went to an assembler in Brisbane, etc)

Mike C

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Mike Cecil

Actually, the Unit sign should go in the 'tac sign holder', and they are the same holder for both Aust cab 12 and 13.

...but they weren't always fitted so perhaps AWM could simply remove it to depict such a vehicle, in accordance with official instructions (which Tony may find less than amusing!):

"Where vehicles have not been fitted with holders and brackets to carry unit signs the manufacture of these may be dispensed with. Similarly the fitting of special bridge classification discs will not be attempted. Instead, the unit sign and bridge sign will be painted on mudguards....and thus labour and material will be saved."

Of course, now that you HAVE made a plate holder Tony, you're compelled to use it: "Where holders, however, are available they will be fitted."

For general interest, the relevant instruction for bridge signs:

"Vehicles will normally be issued with the bridge sign painted on them. If this has not been done it is the duty of the unit to paint the sign on the guard. As it has been found in practice that the present yellow disc tends to nullify the camouflage effect, the size and shape of the yellow background (upon which the figures are painted in black) will be irregular, in accordance with the example."

As Mike says Tony you have some interesting possibilities with the formation sign, the instructions for which are open to interpretation. I quite like the way AWM have handled it on this truck, and I imagine this rendition would have been more common than the black background, which as Mike suggests would be all but impossible to stencil.