Chevrolet C8 1940 Cab 11 restoration, The Netherlands

[Alex van de Wetering]

Guys,

I am trying to work out the rooting of the brake lines and placement of clips in preparation for making new brake lines. I have fitted the remains of the old lines and the master cylinder in the frame to work things out.




-The front section of brake line is probably about the same for all Chev CMPs. Is this section of brake line only held by the two clips just under the radiator?

-The holes in the side of the frame where the above brake line meets the brake hoses....were these holes originally fitted with grommets?

-The rear brake line going from the master cylinder to the right rear section of the frame.
My brake line was cut just behind the cab and one clip remained, which is positioned on the inside of the rear cab support (see picture). Does anyone have a pic of the original rooting of this section of brake line? Is it just a straight line from this clip to just in front of the rear shock absorber...than curving to the bracket which secures it to the rear brake hose....all without clips?




what about the electrical wires running to the rear lights (only right hand side on my truck)??? is this just loosely positioned on the inside of the frame rails or held on with clips???

Comments would be very much appreciated!




By the way, I am still looking for a "brake tee"..."connector"....."junction block"...Chevrolet #596883, please see my thread in the for sale section:

http://mapleleafup.net/forums/showthread.php?t=20272

Alex

Alex

[Bob Carriere]

Hi Alex

I will share my experience based on the C15a which has some application...others can chip in with more C* specific experience.

-The front section of brake line is probably about the same for all Chev CMPs. Is this section of brake line only held by the two clips just under the radiator?

**** Your set up on the dront corss memebr is correct and probably the only section simialr to a C15a

-The holes in the side of the frame where the above brake line meets the brake hoses....were these holes originally fitted with grommets?

****On the the early C15a the steel line stops at the hole in the frame. That hole is filled by the end of the flexible brake line and held in place by a U shape spring clip. The steel brake line is flared and screws in to the end of the flex line. On the outside of the frame, the flex line goes directly to the wheel cylinder..... that means finding a rubber flex line about 18 inches long.... Wagner/Raybestos still makes them and I can dig up the number for you.

-The rear brake line going from the master cylinder to the right rear section of the frame.

*** correct brake lines and wiring are all on the RH side. The line should go to the rear frame and stop about even with the rear axle. The end of the line connects to a strap steel bracket coming form the frake and extending about 8 inches towards the gear housing of the rear axle. To that bracket a simialr but shorter flex line is held in place with a U shape clip. So the steel flared line screws into the end of the rubber line and the flex line reaches down to a 3 way block on the rear axle....brass block usually held in place by a bolt for the rear axle cover. The you have solid steel lines snaking on top of the axle housing to each wheel cylinders.

Now for the clipping or wiring and lines. Phil Waterman will chip in here with his near fire due to loose wiring.

Regardless pf where or how many clips they had to hold the wiring and brake lines in place ***** make sure you instal as many as is requried on your truck to keep everything from rubbing, wearing and potentially start a fire or cause you to loose all braking capacity.

On the C15a the brake lines are runned inside and through cross members and is it, to me anyways, impossible to run one solid line from the master cylinder to the rear axle... you need to have a union joint mid way. I was able to obtain NOS felt gromlets from Brian Ashbury.... my stainless steel brake lines have rubber hose cladding over any area that might rub on a cross member. Now is the time to fiddle with these parts...once the body goes down it becomes a nightmare.

My brake line was cut just behind the cab and one clip remained, which is positioned on the inside of the rear cab support (see picture). Does anyone have a pic of the original rooting of this section of brake line? Is it just a straight line from this clip to just in front of the rear shock absorber...than curving to the bracket which secures it to the rear brake hose....all without clips?.... Yes I think so but we nwo better now!!!

Hope you are still enjoying your project.

Bob

PS looking for some pictures for you

[Bob Carriere]

First of all the front lines going through the frame..... the new ones have clips the original ones had "jam nuts" which may be hard to find or make your own by cuttinga suitable nut in half the thickness.

The long rubber flex line in front were held out of harms way by a spring attached to a clip on the line and the spring was attached to one of the inside fender panel screws.....a primitive design soon replaced on later cab 13.

Spring is about 4 inches long half in. diametre similar to spring used for CMP seat back rest.

Notice the angled brass block on the wheel cylinders....they are items hard to find these days.

Cheers

[motto (RIP)]

For what use it is Bob, the GMC 6x6 CCKW used a similar brake hose set-up on all of its six wheels. The hoses ran direct from chassis to wheel cylinders with a support spring to hold them up.
The springs were produced specifically for that purpose and may possibly be the same item as used on your truck. They are quite easily stretched and were of an unusual construction having the hook at each end made from heavier wire and loosely retained by means of the spring ends being wound in a cone shape.
The captive end of the hook was bent back on itself and could not come out through the hole in the conical end
CCKW parts vendors may still have them.

David

[Alex van de Wetering]

Bob,

It's fascinating to see the detail differences between the different models in de CMP family, even the ones produced during the same period!

I have added a few pics which show the configuration of the C8 brake lines....well, least on mine ;-)

Fitting the brake hoses directly to the frame rails makes sence, but somehow the Chev guys choose to do it different with the C8 (at least have seen this on 3 different C8's). The C8 has a bracket which holds the brake hose.

At the rear the configuration is also slightly different from the C15A....on the C8 a bracket is welded to the rear exle, which holds the brass brake tee and secures to the brake hose. The other end of the brake hose secures to a bracket riveted to the right hand frame rails.

I also added a piece of a picture from Clive's factory photos CD showing a similar rear brake line layout on a MCP Chev. Last but not least is a picture of the (front) brake tee secured to the frame with a clip.

Regardless pf where or how many clips they had to hold the wiring and brake lines in place ***** make sure you instal as many as is requried on your truck to keep everything from rubbing, wearing and potentially start a fire or cause you to loose all braking capacity.

Thanks for the advice Bob. I was kind of thinking of adding a few extra clips here and there to keep everything in the right spot....I even have a few holes available in the frame which don't seem to be used for anything else. "seem" as I am not sure if they ought to be used for the wiring loom(?). Anyhow, I will probably secure the bake line on a few extra locations, but that does mean adding a few extra bends in the brake lines to get to all the existing holes, as all the "spare" holes are not in line with the orginal (?) routing of the brake lines.

Hope you are still enjoying your project

Definately! But, I have lost a bit of momentum in the project as the budget jar is about empty for now and I need to sort a few details first before I can continue. I know if's part of the fun....but I always try to do the "detective work" during the weekdays and the labout during the weekends!

Alex

[Alex van de Wetering]

Quote:
an unusual construction having the hook at each end made from heavier wire and loosely retained by means of the spring ends being wound in a cone shape.

David; your description on the springs sounds a lot like the springs used inside the Chevy brake drums to hold the brake shoes.....No idea if the C8 used springs on the brake hoses at all....on mine there is no sign of them, but I guess the hoses could have easily been replaced during it's lifetime.



oh..the C8 brake hoses up front are the same as the one at the rear, # 476719. Luckily these are available at most Chev parts suppliers! Thanks for the offer Bob, but I guess for once it's a benifit that the C8 is largely based on civvy components ;-)

Alex

[Alex van de Wetering]

Dirk at LWD was able to help me with an alternative brake junction block. We had a few to choose from and I decided to go for this one as it uses the same thread size as on the original block and also the same thread on all three holes. Basically it means I can swap the block easily if I ever find the original one.
There was only one problem....it's Ford.....but, as you can see in one of the is the manufacturer for these blocks seem to be the same, "W".

The block has a hole in it to secure it to the frame with a bolt, in stead of the clip as used on the original.
I modified two thick washers to fill up the hole and to get the new bolthole off-centre, so the block would sit a close to the original location as possible.