Littlefield Collection & Auction

[Ed Storey]

Anyone with a collection of anything regardless of the size or value will have the problem of finding a home for it after the person who built the collection wants/needs to move it on. Family members, other collectors or museums are great places to pass this material on to; and even if those people or institutions are keen to look after the collection, there is never a guarantee that they will look after it once they gain possession or the people/organization who get it after them.

We are only caretakers of this material for a short time, so in the end I think a collection owner has to be happy with whoever gets the collection and sit back and think that at least they looked after or preserved it while they had it.

[Phil Waterman]

Hi All

Ed hit the nail squarely on the head with his finial line:

"We are only caretakers of this material for a short time, so in the end I think a collection owner has to be happy with whoever gets the collection and sit back and think that at least they looked after or preserved it while they had it."

Having worked with non-profit organizations and foundation for most of my working life, I know where to look up and review the financials of US non-profit organizations. I've read through the Collings Foundations returns and they seem to be the real deal with some real financial strength both in the foundation and behind it. So there is hope that the collection or major parts will be preserved.

But going back to Ed's point each collector/museum can only try to do the best while they posses the collection.

Cheers Phil

[Chuck Anderson]

I don't have a problem with it.

All of the family members have over $100 million EACH. Any money they might get from this sale is chump change to them. Even if they do profit from the sale, why is that bothersome? People profit (and suffer) all the time from their parent's or grandparent's life choices. Jaques himself benefitted from his grandfather's work, whether Jaques was interested in it or not, and there's where he got all of the money to put the collection together. The Foundation is the "owner" of the vast majority of the vehicles & parts. Jaques had some in his name, but not too much. The Foundation is a non-profit and is required to pass its assets to another non-profit. Any income would go into the non-profit and not to the family. Add to that the expense that Jaques put into each vehicle. The vehicle was his passion, not the cost. I don't know what the end result is, but from a family position, its a write-off.

We as collectors all benefit (and suffer) from the the involvement of the Jaques Littlefields of the world. Whenever Jaques was looking for something, prices around the world would increase. People in would dig up or scrounge up vehicles and/or parts because a billionaire was looking for them. That helps us by bringing a lot of rare stuff onto the market and hurts us in that the prices went way up when we wanted a vehicle or parts. Then again, it caused the market values to increase making everybody's MVs worth more. Now that the "big fish" are dissapearing (Littlefield, Gibb, Budge, Ropkey, Wheatcroft isn't buying much) the money isn't flowing like it use to.

There a quite a few of us that are getting up there in years and before too long the market will be flooded with MVs. The question is what will they be going for? Is there a new generation that cares enough about them to spend that kind of money on them? If Collings is going to auction off over 100 of the vehicles, I wonder how much they'll command? I was stunned last December at the auction in Indiana. Maybe there's a new wave of millionaires that love this stuff.

This is why I don't gamble.

[maple_leaf_eh]

Originally Posted by Ed Storey

Anyone with a collection of anything regardless of the size or value will have the problem of finding a home for it after the person who built the collection wants/needs to move it on. ...

And Ed should know. He collects Canadian militaria and webbing.

[Duane Leiker]

I don't know where you come up with a non profit to non profit only asset transfer. This is what I found in the non profit corporate codes and is not verbatim. Do I have the wrong codes???

A non profit does not have to liquidate its assets to another non profit. If the non profit board votes (75%+ shareholders) to auction or sell, it can for the benefit of the non profit. Also, if the non profit files "dissolution", it can liquidate assets in auction or sell assets to anyone or organization to cover debts.

I have seen other non profits auction material off and felt the statement strange. **** I am NOT trying to get into a pis-ing contest or create ill feelings with anyone. **** I felt the statement incorrect and looked it up. This is what I found. Thats all.

[Chuck Anderson]

Sorry if I'm wrong or speaking out of ignorance.

When I started a 501c3 non-profit here in Oregon, the Corporation Division required a 501c3 non-profit corporation upon dissolution, to donate its assets, either cash or hard assets, to another 501c3. Hard assets could be sold (to pretty much anyone) to pay creditors, but none of the of the proceeding cash or other assets were to benefit the directors or officers of the dissolving 501c3.

Perhaps its different now (this was 20 years ago), and/or different in various states and the Fed.

Also, since mine is a Mutual Benefit 501c3 versus a Foundation, perhaps the rules are different in that regard as well.

[Phil Waterman]

Hi All

We maybe getting to technical about non-profits for the purpose of this thread.

When I mention having checked out the Collings Foundation it was meant as reassurance that they are in fact a real non-profit with some strength.

I don't think any of us are questioning the transfer of assets from one non-profit to another. In fact I think we are all saying that it looks like one good Foundation to another.

The whole issue of what museums do and can do with their collections probably deserves a separate thread. It is as pointed out a question us collectors should be aware of.

If anyone would like to know how to actually check out a US non-profit drop me a private message and I'll send you the link and explain a little how to read the material, it is all public information.

Cheers Phil

[matilda IIA]

Auctions America will be conducting the auction of the Littlefield Collection 11/12 JUL 14.

http://www.auctionsamerica.com/event...?SaleCode=LC14

[Mike Cecil]

That's just great! Four days before W&P starts, and right after Duxford! Scratches my attendance....

Mike C