Water in the oil

[Little Jo]

Originally Posted by Lynn Eades

Tony, A corrosion inhibitor prevents the build up of rust inside the block head etc.(assuming it is clean to start with) this then allows an efficient transfer of heat to the water, and away to the air at the radiator. The inhibitors do require careful sealing as they are inclined to leak more easily than plain water.
Keep in mind that 90+ percent of engine failures stem from cooling system problems. Does your engine have steel core ( or frost,or expansion) plugs? Is it worth trying to prevent any further internal corrosion of your block or head etc. from what you say the tin plated retainer for your thermostat had rotted away, so the inside of your block must also be slowly corroding. All that stuff helps to block up your radiator(don't forget to flush it, from top and bottom)
Yes I would recommend an inhibitor. An anti freeze type usually should be replaced yearly, whereas something like Fuchs engine coolant(German brand) might outlast you. (you mix it 50% with your rain water)

Hi Lynn

From what I am being told it is a good idea to use a corrosion inhibitor. One of our club members came around this morning and I showed him the stripped down head. He also suggested using an inhibitor and said as there were so many types in use to speak to Repco and they can advise what would be good inhibitor for the old girl.

I had the radiator rebuild 18 months ago and when I drained it before removing the head the water was still clear and clean, I will flush it doing the top and bottom before putting in the new thermostat and retainer. I know that when I filled the radiator it always seemed to find it's own level in the top tank after a drive.

I hope that after the head is shaved and all is back together I have solved the problem, but if there is still water in the oil after that then It means the engine coming out and stripping it down to find the leak. When my club friend had a look at the old gasket and head he suggested the head may not have been torqued down properly. Geez I hope that is all it was as if it is the block then I will be off the road for some time. Fingers crossed.

Thanks for all you good advice and suggestions.

Cheers

Tony

[Phil Waterman]

Hi All

Three of the reasons I have always heard for using a 50/50 mix of antifreeze are:

1. Freeze protection down something like -35C even then it doesn't freeze like water hard but instead the water starts to separate out as ice crystals making a mush which doesn't pump through the engine very well.
2. Rust inhibitor, which depending on your local water can be very important in preventing rust. In the US even rain water may be acetic particularly in the North East.
3. Higher boiling point a 50/50 mix of antifreeze even in a non-pressurized system has a significantly higher boiling point than just plain water. Going to one of the company data sheets they list boiling point as being 107C (226F)
   and freeze point as -37C (-34F) for 50/50 mix.

On one occasion when setting up a new engine 261cu.in. for my C60S I didn't use antifreeze or rust inhibitor while I was testing the engine and had significant rust damage to the water pump adapter plate in a very short period of time. Rust pitted the plate to the point that it had to be replaced because of a weeper leak in the sealing surface. Lesson learned now I always use either rust inhibitor or antifreeze any time I fill a cooling system.


I have also seen the difference in cooling once when having a cooling problem on my Pat 12 C60L as I blew water out of the system because of overheating and replaced it on the move with a pressure pump putting water back into the system the overheating kept getting worse and worse as the antifreeze in the engine was gradually replaced by plain water.


Cheers Phil

[Little Jo]

Originally Posted by Phil Waterman

Hi All

Three of the reasons I have always heard for using a 50/50 mix of antifreeze are:

1. Freeze protection down something like -35C even then it doesn't freeze like water hard but instead the water starts to separate out as ice crystals making a mush which doesn't pump through the engine very well.
2. Rust inhibitor, which depending on your local water can be very important in preventing rust. In the US even rain water may be acetic particularly in the North East.
3. Higher boiling point a 50/50 mix of antifreeze even in a non-pressurized system has a significantly higher boiling point than just plain water. Going to one of the company data sheets they list boiling point as being 107C (226F)
   and freeze point as -37C (-34F) for 50/50 mix.

On one occasion when setting up a new engine 261cu.in. for my C60S I didn't use antifreeze or rust inhibitor while I was testing the engine and had significant rust damage to the water pump adapter plate in a very short period of time. Rust pitted the plate to the point that it had to be replaced because of a weeper leak in the sealing surface. Lesson learned now I always use either rust inhibitor or antifreeze any time I fill a cooling system.


I have also seen the difference in cooling once when having a cooling problem on my Pat 12 C60L as I blew water out of the system because of overheating and replaced it on the move with a pressure pump putting water back into the system the overheating kept getting worse and worse as the antifreeze in the engine was gradually replaced by plain water.


Cheers Phil

Hi Phil

I am so grateful for the terrific information and assistance I am receiving from fellow MLU members. You guys have helped this poor novice since joining the forum 3 years ago when I started my Jeep restoration project. By following your advice I have gained the confidence to now tackle any problem that arises. The wealth of experience you guys have comes, I am sure from having been through similar happenings along the way. I will follow your advice to the letter, how can I go wrong.

Thanks. Phil, Lynn, Grant, Keith, Mike and Richard for your support and assistance.

Cheers

Tony

[Little Jo]

Hi Guys

Well I am ready to fit the Cylinder Head back on. So far I have replaced the old Thermostat with a new one and a new retainer. I have also replaced the original bolts with new studs. (See Photos). I had a look at my new cylinder Head Gasket, which is sealed and Silver in colour. It is a 17446.01 Gasket head -L-head type. There is a printed note in 3 languages inside which state.

CAUTION
* The surface of this head gasket has been treated with a coating for better sealability.
* DO NOT use any chemicals or sealers. It must be installed dry.

I have not come across this before as everyone is telling me to spray a copper coating sealant on the metal side before replacing the head. My Question is, do I follow the enclosed instructions that came with the Head gasket, or do I go ahead with the copper spray sealant. Have any of you guys out there in MLU land come across a similar scenario.

PHOTOS.
1. Prepared head ready to put back on.
2. Cleaned up top of the block showing new Studs.

I do want to do the right thing and have no more leaks. Thanks guys.

Cheers

Tony

[Richard Farrant]

Hi Tony,
These modern material gaskets do seal like the proverbial sh*t to blanket once they are installed and applying any extra sealer may compromise their abilities. Providing block and head surfaces are good and head is tightened correctly and retightened after a run, then all will be good. I always tighten down a head in small increments, that way it is goes down steadily.
I fitted a pattern head gasket to my brother's Willys MB about 25 years ago, and it was made in Brazil, I was sceptical as it was a modern type, but in fact it was the best jeep gasket I had ever come across and still fitted.

My thoughts ....

regards, Richard

[Lynn Eades]

I see it like Richard. Follow the manufactures advice. See how you go.

[Phil Waterman]

Hi Tony

Did you happen to test and exercise the new thermostat by chance before putting it in? If not probably will be OK. But I have found over the last 10 years that many NEW thermostats are very slow to open the first couple of heat cycles which on a freshly rebuilt engine can be problem it the temp comes up real quick. It is real annoying to blow water out of the radiator on the first start just because the thermostat stuck the first time, leaves you chasing a problem that by they maybe gone.

The other thing I have found that the first time they open they may actually not open until 20 degrees F past their stated value. After they have been cycled a couple of times they seem to settle down and work correctly.

I test/exercise them by putting pan of hot water and bring them up to the rated temp or until they open. Then take them out of the water and let them cool doing this a couple of times seems to do the trick. The ones I've done this too the difference on how much quicker they respond after a few cycles is very evident.

Of course when ever I put a bunch of thermostats in the pot, my wife asks what I'm fixing for lunch.

Cheers Phil

PS Know I've mentioned this before but every time I buy a thermostat it is slow to open the first time.