M113 Lynx photos needed for book project

[Hanno Spoelstra]

AFAIK, the manufacturer's (FMC) designation was M113 C&R (Command & Reconnaissance).

The Royal Netherlands Army designated it as M113 C&V. "C&V" stands for Commando & Verkenning, which is Dutch for Command & Reconnaissance. The first 250 manufactured went to the Netherlands in 1966, the rest went to Canada so you could be right about the CR1 and CR2.

First picture shows one in preservation at the National Military Museum, the second on shows the fate of most of them - range target! Although a number have been exported to Chile, I believe.

108458_003.jpg.1200x630_q85.jpg 16294489545_e8296bf12a_b.jpg

[maple_leaf_eh]

Originally Posted by Hanno Spoelstra

Although a number have been exported to Chile, I believe.

A batch were exported to Bahrain in the Persian Gulf. I spotted a group in a parade in someone's photo gallery. Today searching again, I can't find any clear statement. (I wonder if they were retired in good order, and transferred to 'other parties' for the civil war in Yemen?) Edit - Found it!

https://milinme.wordpress.com/2013/0...e-m113-family/

[Richard Farrant]

I was holding back on posting this but after Terry's post, take a look at the link here to a book. The publisher appears to be an official organisation, and book subject on vehicle trials lists the M113 1/2.
http://www.amazon.com/MUDLARK-Tests-.../dp/B0007J20AC

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by maple_leaf_eh

A batch were exported to Bahrain in the Persian Gulf. I spotted a group in a parade in someone's photo gallery. Today searching again, I can't find any clear statement. (I wonder if they were retired in good order, and transferred to 'other parties' for the civil war in Yemen?) Edit - Found it!

https://milinme.wordpress.com/2013/0...e-m113-family/

I recall you posting that link - those are certainly ex-RNLA M113 C&R's and YPR-785's! I think they were sold to Egypt as well.

I hear you thinking: YPR-785? Well, that's the Dutch designation for the AIFV (Armored Infantry Fighting Vehicle) based on the M113 - another variant for which no US military designation exists as they were not used by the US.

[Douglas Greville]

M113 1/2 was the FMC "in house" designation for the Lynx whilst they were developing and offering it around, quite a few countries trialed it.

Once they produced the prototypes it became "Vehicle Command and Reconnaissance" (nothing else) and that is what is on the data plate of that vehicle.
The 2 documented prototypes were known to FMC as "C&R 1" and "C&R 2", both of which were to the original layout with the observer seated to the right of the driver.

Then, when the Dutch bought it, the designation changed to:
"Vehicle, Command and Reconnaissance, Full Tracked, Armored, M113A1 C & R"
Serial numbers beginning with CR1-00XX. Apparently they were hoping to sell thousands......
The Dutch kept with the as built side by side layout, but upgraded to an auto cannon turret for the Commander.

Then for the Canadian contract:
"Carrier, Command and Reconnaissance, Full Tracked, Armored (Lynx).

Nobody seems to know how and when the name "Lynx" came to the vehicle. The issue with the Canadian data plates is that they all appear to be re-issues at time of rebuild, so it is unknown if they are spares supplied by the manufacturer or Canadian produced, thus if the name came from FMC or not.

[Robin Craig]

Not wishing to hijack this thread but actually add something, does anyone know where the British trials vehicle of the Lynx family ended up after the auction at the Littlefield Collection?

That would be a start point in a book for my money

Robin

[Ed Storey]

Does anyone have a copy of an actual FMC document that uses the term M113 1/2 or is this all conjecture?

[Douglas Greville]

I don't post messages with conjecture stated as fact.

If I am doubtful about something I say so.

FMC changed the name of the vehicle multiple times, I have the relevant images.

Regards
Doug

[Perry Kitson]

The Lynx manufactured for the Canadian army had the observer moved to a position to the left rear of the commanders cupola. Perhaps this is the reason CR-1 and CR-2 manufacturers designations.

[Douglas Greville]

Originally Posted by Perry Kitson

The Lynx manufactured for the Canadian army had the observer moved to a position to the left rear of the commanders cupola. Perhaps this is the reason CR-1 and CR-2 manufacturers designations.

Perry

To the best of my knowledge that is exactly the reason for the 2 different designations.

There was a "Super Lynx" version, but nobody bought it, so it never got beyond prototype stage. Outwardly it looked pretty much the same hull, with an uprated engine and weapons station IIRC. I don't have the details.

Regards
Doug