Canadian Dodge, 3 ton 4x2

[Kevin Goodwin]

Hi all I have lost patience with the site as it will not allow me to upload any more pictures! I will have another try another day.
Kevin

[lynx42]

Hi Kevin,

Welcome to MLU. You have come to the right place to get information.

Your Dodge is a good looking truck and looks like it won't be too much of a restoration.

Here in OZ we had quite a few Dodge D 60420.C, 3 ton 4x2 trucks with the turret opening in the roof and blitz wheels on the front.

Here are some photos of one I had a look at about 12 months ago. Not a tipper but a GS tray.

Regards Rick.

AWM & Dodge 092.JPG

Sitting in a paddock for many many years, it is remarkably complete.

AWM & Dodge 094.JPG

The back end showing the towbar.

AWM & Dodge 103.JPG

ID Plate for the D 60420.C

AWM & Dodge 107.JPG

Known as a D110L. over here.

AWM & Dodge 112.JPG

16 inch x 10.50 tyres on the front and 20 inch x 7.50 on the rear.

[lynx42]

Some more photos

AWM & Dodge 117.JPG

Military clearance black out lights

AWM & Dodge 121.JPG

Front on.

AWM & Dodge 122.JPG

Roof hatch open.

AWM & Dodge 143.JPG

2 speed differential.

AWM & Dodge 099.JPG

Gear change plate and others.

Regards Rick.

BTW. Kevin, try reducing the size of the photos and you will be able to add 5 at a time.

[Tony Smith]

Hello, and welcome to the forum.

The manual I referred to in Tom Watts's thread (MANUAL), shows the TL110-L5 as originally having 10.50-16 tyres front and rear (to Contract SM 2458, dated 30 Jun 42, co-incidentally shown in "Light Stone" or sand paint). It was common practice in post-war Australia (and I suspect Britain would be similar) to fit dual wheels to the rear of many War-surplus vehicles to increase the legally allowed capacity of the truck in civilian service.

Bedford and Austin truck duals have the same wheel stud pattern as the WD single wheel, and are a straight swap on the rear axle. As a dual wheel rim has a different "offset" to a single rim, they must be fitted with a spacer (or a different design hub) on the front axle to maintain steering geometry, but on a 4x2 vehicle any variation in tyre diameter isn't as critical as on a 4x4, so often it was simpler to keep the original wheel on the front axle.

[Tony Smith]

Originally Posted by lynx42

Here in OZ we had quite a few Dodge D 60420.C, 3 ton 4x2 trucks with the turret opening in the roof ....

All of the Dodge 4x2 60cwts I have seen here have this roof hatch, but as seen in Kevin's pics and the parts manual pic, the hatch wasn't originally specified in the contract. The Hatch and grab handles are very similar to the style fitted to Australian Ford CMPs and MCPs. I wonder if the hatch was an Australian requirement, and was installed locally by Ford?

[Tony Smith]

More (Australian) Dodge info in THIS THREAD.

[Lang]

Tony

The Australian Dodges were delivered direct to Australian forces in the Middle East to an Australian order (not ex-British). About half had 16" singles and half had 20" Duals. There is a note that the duals were for prime mover.

I will scan the documents when I can find them.

I had two cabs both with the plates above the centre of the windscreen which were from those contracts. both had square roof hatch and right hand drive.

lang

[Kevin Goodwin]

Thanks for the replies, the attached pictures are quite useful for future info, my truck is missing the rear tow hitch assembly which I will need to source, the gun hatch on my truck is the circular design, this will also need to be sourced or fabricated, any leads on these parts would be gratefully received.
The dash on my truck is also the same as the other pictures posted.
Regarding the wheels presently fitted, I would prefer to have single wheels all round, especially if it was a war time spec plus for the convenience of carrying just the one spare, this will mean I need to source two more split rims.
I am leaning towards a finish that represents the events in Scily / Italy namely sand colour with the bold camouflage, that's a little way off at this point lol.
I will post some more pictures when I have time, I will also post the pictures of the restoration as it progresses, there will no doubt be numerous questions I need to ask!
Kevin

[Tony Smith]

Originally Posted by lynx42

Here in OZ we had quite a few Dodge D 60420.C, 3 ton 4x2 trucks with the turret opening in the roof.

Attachment 92925
ID Plate for the D 60420.C

Originally Posted by Lang

The Australian Dodges were delivered direct to Australian forces in the Middle East to an Australian order (not ex-British).
lang

Lang, I have several pics of Dodge data plates in Australia, and they are all from Contract Supply Mech 2458, which as the Canadian Manual states is for the British Army. If they are from an Australian order, the order was placed against British WD stocks (not ex-British Army), and not direct from Dodge in Canada.

Are there any pics of Australian Dodges in the Middle East with the square hatch, as it certainly resembles the Ford Australia design and seems to have been fitted here. Or alternately, are there any extant Dodges from SM2458 in the UK with the square hatch?

David Hayward would have been good to get to the bottom of this.

[Lang]

Tony

David provided most of my information.

I will find the delivery records soon but seem to recall an annotation of "against Australian Order 1234"

The square hatch on the Dodge is much more compact and neater than that found on say a Blitz

Lang

[Tony Smith]

Originally Posted by lynx42

Here in OZ we had quite a few Dodge D 60420.C, 3 ton 4x2 trucks with the turret opening in the roof and blitz wheels on the front.

Another has appeared on Ebay, appears to be a complete and straight, rust free truck. Just needs work.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VINTAGE-D...K/142475528241

[Mike Cecil]

Hi Lang and Tony,

The hatch is a standard Aust hatch as fitted to Ford Cab 12 CMPs in Australia, utes, etc. It was an Aust Army requirement, fitted by the assembler after the vehicle arrived in Australia. That's why you don't see them on the order, or on vehicles supplied to other countries such as Britain.

It's dimensions were smaller front to back than the hatch on Cab 13 CMP Fords in Australia, but the same from side to side.

The design was a stamped inner welded to a stamped outer, with a hatch rim welded into an aperture cut into the roof of the vehicle. The handles are standard hardware door handles, riveted to a top-hat section welded to the roof in front of the hatch. The handle on the inside of the hatch was the same as the grab handles, and the catch/lock was a standard hardware small-size slide bolt. The hinges were also standard hardware items.

The AWM has a very nice original example. Look up REL24655 on the AWM website.

Mike

[Lang]

Mike

Did the Dodges brought back from the middle east get sent to the workshop in Australia to have the hatches retrofitted?

I just sold two Dodge cabs with their plates on. Both were from the order delivered to the middle east and both had hatches.

Lang

[Kevin Goodwin]

Hi all, things are slowly moving forward with the truck in preparation for collection, on one of the trips to the truck I removed the 2 data plates from the drivers side a post, the larger plate shows the serial number the same as the plate above the windscreen, the other small plate has the following numbers 4292-33326 does anyone know what these numbers relate to? This small plate is plain metal has no other details other than the numbers.
On the list of 'needs' are the 10.50x16 tyres I have had a look on the web for options, the only company I have found is 'Mittas' does anyone have any other suggestions ? There are agricultural implement tyres available but the speed rating is only 40kph (although the weight rating is approx 3.5ton per tyre)
Another thing I have been hunting online for is a picture of these trucks in service with the British, there seem to be plenty of Chevrolet's and Fords but no Dodges other than a few of the 'tipper' variant, has anyone else come across any other pictures?
Kevin

[Lang]

Kevin

Your truck comes from Contract Number 2677. Starting Serial 91063001 ending 91067000. The WD bonnet serial numbers are from L5405350 to L5407859. If you do a cross reference count you should get your original bonnet number for that truck (assuming they numbered them in order). The engine number you put up does not seem right - misread or replaced at some time?


Tony

This sheet indicates the 110 Dodges were shipped "Direct Overseas" for Mid-East and then Australian Forces. The manual has Contract SM 2458 on it because this was the first contract to those specifications. I bet the trucks coming 28 contracts later still had Contract SM 2458 on the cover of their manuals.

Mike

The Dodge vehicles on a W.D. Central Census to 23 November 1944 listing the Dodges delivered to that date all have WD numbers and WD Cat reference for each order eg

WD No From Z4613111 to WD No Z4613593 Cat Reference 8 Contract SM2029
Truck 8-CWT 4X4 Personnel (including shipped to Egypt) Model D8A

The 110 Dodges are shown in a total of 28 contracts including one annotated as AID-CHI 25 - I presume aid to China (Burma Road?)

All have WD number ranges and Cat references beside them EXCEPT for the Australian orders as attached. This coincides with my theory that they were direct Australian orders as they were not allocated a British WD number. You can see they were a mix of single and dual wheel (100 thereof).They of course would have been processed through the British ordering and shipping system alongside the British trucks but there seems to be pretty clear distinction they were not one group.

The very first 110 truck contract was SM2458 which was the Australian vehicles. The first British 110 were not until SM2666. Unfortunately the sheet does not show dates and they could well have been days apart.

Lang