How To: C15a Wire-3 restoration

[Hanno Spoelstra]

Originally Posted by Jordan Baker

Bob, when you say you used Speedy Sleeves, did they replace the original leather seals? Do you have part numbers? I was checking the shafts and they have a visible worn spot where they would seal on the leather. I presume this is what the speedy sleeves would fix?

Hello Jordan,

If you go to http://www.skf.com/group/products/se...eve/index.html, one can read everything there is to know about Speedi-Sleeves, Choosing the right size and Installing and Removing SKF Speedi-Sleeve.

HTH,
Hanno

[Jordan Baker]

Thanks all. I’ve got my reading list and will figure out what I’ll use with regards to the speedi sleeves. All of the shafts have a worn grove so I’ll have to do something.

All of the casing parts are now clean ready for PORing tomorrow. They all soaked in the parts cleaner solution, then subjected to some power washing. I then sandblasted everything. After that everything was power washed again to remove the grit residue. Then I soaked them in Marine Clean, then another power washing. After this they were hit with Metal Prep etching solution. Now everything is so clean I’d eat a dry cracker off of them.

Tomorrow my plan is to spray with POR then top coat in the blue primer. I’m thinking I’ll probably do the final Army colour once final assembly is done.

[Bob Carriere]

Nice job.....

Keep in mind that the bearing races/cones will not go in where you have POR....either tape off the bare metal area or scrap the POR with a sharp Exacto blade.

Speedy sleeves go on bare metal with locktite.... any POR will make them almost impossible to fit as the clearances is so tight.

Make sure you wash your brass shims carefully and account for the paper gasket thickness in setting the preload. Each bearing should be able to rotate by hand ...otherwise its too tight. Same for the fully assembled T case it should rotate by hand when fully put together. \

Have lots of paper towels and solvent to repeatedly wash you hands during re assembly.

Can you imagine the poor guys doing this work in North Africa in between sand storms!!!!!! while being shot at!!!!

You should have been a surgeon.

Cheers

Cheers

[Jordan Baker]

Stopped off at a bearing shop today.

Myself and the guy behind the counter measured up the seals and shafts and came to the following modern parts. Parts are ordered and I should have them tomorrow morning.

Transfer Case
Modern oil seal part number is SKF 19360 QTY3
Speedi Sleeve is SKF 99193 QTY 3

Bearings as listed in the parts manual.
Timken 332. QTY 6
Timken 339. QTY 5
Timken 342-S. QTY 1
Timken 14274 QTY 2
Timken 14137 QTY 2

[Jordan Baker]

Spent yesterday and today painted the transfer case parts. First in DOM16 ( Cnd version of POR15). Then in tie coat primer. Today was the final colour of SCC2. I also picked up the order of Speedi Sleeves and oil seals. I’ll give the paint a few days to harden up before installing the seals and the sleeves. Next week I should have the bearings and cones. I also had all the fasteners from the case in a tumbler with blasting grit in order to clean them up. I left it running for about 20hrs. Followed up with a quick buffing on a brass wire wheel they are good to go.

[Bob Carriere]

Fantastic job!!!!!!!

[Jordan Baker]

All my new bearings arrived yesterday so I made a quick run to the USA to pick them up. All went smoothly crossing the boarder both coming and going and I was home in no time.

Today I began disassembling the shafts and gears to clean them up. All has gone well except for the idle shaft. I don’t have the special tool for removing the speedometer gear. It’s tool J1737. I suspect it is simply a tool shaft that has matching female threads of the speedometer gear to screw on. I did try a bearing removal tool and it chipped part of it.

I’m not sure if I’ll need to source a new one or not.

I believe the GM# is 1811722

I see from the LWD site they have a Ford part that looks the same. Part # C01Q-17285-A. Does anyone know if they cross over?

[Grant Bowker]

Your image of the tool is the one I see in MB-C2. MB-C1 shows a 2 armed puller, but gives the same tool number as shown in your image. Odd.
Based on the image, I would have interpreted the gear involved as being the spiral type mounted to the end of the transfer case idler shaft. I'm not expert but would interpret this as the driving gear and the smaller gear that engages both this one and the speedometer cable as the driven gear. (Both fall in parts group 4.337 so the diagram doesn't make it clear which is which.)

The gear I think of as driving, Chevrolet number1809534, is listed in a Ford parts book as equivalent to C01Q-17285-A and is described as having 4 teeth while a couple of other driving gears with only Ford part numbers are described as having 5 teeth. I think this is the gear you mention on LWD's site: https://www.lwdparts.com/product/gear-speedo-driven-2/ which seems to be the one listed as being common to the Chevrolet. LWD have another listing for a speedometer gear, driven that is the other part of the speedometer gearing https://www.lwdparts.com/product/gear-speedo-driven/ Be cautious with terminology to be sure you get what you need.
C01Q-17285-A is listed as appling to F15A, F30, F60S, L, H and FGT. 1809534is listed in Chev parts books as suiting C15A, C30, C60 S, L and X and CG. I didn't check any of the armoured vehicle books.

This gear is listed in the C15A0-04 parts list as one of the * parts, "peculiar to CMP vehicles", but is not so marked in the C60X-04 list. Puzzling.

Most of the non-CMP parts books I have seem to treat the driving and driven gears as items to be ordered as a matched pair rather than individual gears. These sets are all 6 digit numbers instead of 7 digit, suggesting earlier the CMP parts may be later (possibly by being designed to match the transfer case shaft instead of the transmission output shaft as in 2WD civilian pattern trucks. The Modified Conventional Pattern Chevrolets seem to follow the civilian method of treating the gears as "gear unit, speedometer drive".

How badly damaged is your gear? Any chance the driven gear rides on the part that escaped damage?

[Jordan Baker]

Thanks for the help. My bad on the other part number. I read off he wrong line in the parts book when I was typing out my post.

The worm gear on the end of the idle shaft should be GM 1809534 Gear Speedometer Drive ( 4 teeth). From what you have, this part is the same as the Ford C01Q-17285-A?

Also here is the picture of different tool for removing the worm gear.


I stopped off at the shop tonight and we might be able to make a copy of the puller as found in MB-C2. He didn’t think where I had the small chips would be any issue as the other gear should just be riding in the middle.

[rob love]

There does not appear to be anything special about that puller. I'm pretty sure I have that in both OTC and snapon.

I think a small to medium bearing puller (the plate type that has two halves) and a little heat from a propane torch would make quick work of that job, and provide much more support to the gear.

[Jordan Baker]

I tried the plate type of bearing/gear remover and it quickly chipped the bottom of it so I stopped. I’ll try some heat on it tomorrow.

[David Herbert]

Originally Posted by Jordan Baker

I tried the plate type of bearing/gear remover and it quickly chipped the bottom of it so I stopped. I’ll try some heat on it tomorrow.

Did you use it flat side to the speedo drive gear ?

David

[Lynn Eades]

Jordan,once again, no knowledge on my part. What does the nut behind the gear do?
Can you use it to push the gear a bit?
If you heat the gear, a quick heat like oxy accetylene will get you the gear hot without the shaft getting hot at the same time. If you use the ring gear fitting method of using a wooden match to check the heat. That is, do not heat past the point where a match will char or "slips' easily sideways (loss of friction)
Something like a chain vicegrip might swing it off, when it is hot. I hope this lot helps.

[Grant Bowker]

A PDF of the pages on speedometer parts from Ford book SE 39-42 is attached to let you confirm.

[Jordan Baker]

Transfer case gears are all done. Well almost, just waiting for a speedometer drive worm gear to arrive from Holland. The original one chipped the threads while being removed. All new bearings, everything taken apart and cleaned up. Bearings were all dipped in oil before assembly. I’m currently just working on installing the new bearing races back into the case and cover. I also assembled the declutch shaft and carrier.

[Bob Carriere]

When you consider the limited 85 BHP..... of all the T case I have opened the gears are always in good shape.

Another alternative to dipping the bearings is to inject some molyb. grease with the needle of the grease gun into the bearing cage.....then spin by hand to coat evenly...... messy but it works and at least they do not start dry.

Good job Junior!!!!

[Lynn Eades]

Jordan, that speedo drive worm gear (as someone has already said) will be fine to use. There will be no tooth load where the damage is. It would be good to dress the edges where the damage is.

[Jordan Baker]

I’m playing it safe and have a new speedometer worm gear on the way. I was thinking the chips shouldn’t be an issue, however when I lined up the other gear the teeth do pass over the one chip. Considering everything is opened up right now it’s easier to replace with NOS now versus down the road.

[rob love]

Good on you for waiting, but I would concur with the others. The actual load on that pair of gears is so minimal, they usually make them out of plastic these days.

[rob love]

Jordan

I was just out in the shop and there sitting on the bench is a factory box with 2 GM 1809534Gear, speed. If you want me to, I can express post one to you (you would likely not have it until Thursday due to the Canada day Monday) but it's yours if you want it. Not being a chevy guy, I don't need one back.

[Stewart Loy]

Jordan,

If you want it, you can have the old t-case that was left behind when I parted out an old truck many moons ago.

Free to a good home - some heavy lifting is required.


Stewart

[Jordan Baker]

Thanks guys. Ill send some PM’s in the morning. I’m headed to bed as work starts earlier enough. (Yes I do actually work contrary to what some believe)

[Jordan Baker]

The NOS speedometer drive gear arrived today and was promptly installed. I then finished putting the case back together. This rebuild is done and ready to be mounted back in the frame.

[Jordan Baker]

Today has been a driveshaft kind of day. I finished pressing out the Spicer U joints on the shop press. I have to say that the shop press has definitely earned its keep in the shop and it’s one of the tools I use a lot.

Everything is off to the blasting cabinet currently. Then I’ll be prepping for the POR treatment.

[Phil Waterman]

Hi Jordan


You probably already thought of this or have heard it before. Align all the grease fittings.



An Old Motor Pool Sergeant took one look at my drive shafts and said I'd done them wrong. He went on to explain that all the grease fitting should be in a line on each shaft so as to make greasing easier. Next time I did a drive shaft I paid attention to alignment and darned if he wasn't correct.


Cheers Phil

[David Herbert]

Good tip and so simple to do !

David

[Jordan Baker]

Yes i read that previous post while researching what to do and not do. But thanks for the reminder.

[Jordan Baker]

Today I finished up with the final cleaning of the driveshafts and components. After the usual marine clean and metal prep I then hand painted them in DOM16. This is the Canadian version of the POR15. It is cheaper, UV safe and supposedly be top coated anytime after curing. The downside to me is that it’s only available in gloss black. Even with hand painting it will self level to a mirror finish. Today I took advantage of the very humid weather and after about an hr the DOM16 was just tacky. I then simply sprayed on the SCC2 paint. This will then bond to the DOM16 and be very strong.

Anyway the driveshafts are all painted. I just need to now get the Spricer U joints ordered and get things assembled.

One question, are the “washers” in the caps made from industrial felt? The caps are at the end of splines. None of mine had anything left other then the split metal washer. I’m thinking felt would be good for sealing out the dirt and grime yet retaining the grease.

[Jordan Baker]

Lastly for today my friend Matt was over working on his project with some help from me. Anyway back to he truck, I took advantage of him being over so that I could try and get the transfer case back into the frame. We ended up removing the tool box and spare tire carrier, slid the transfer case under the frame on a dolly. Then using the shop hoist I was able to sling a strap and we lifted the case up and into the frame. In hindsight it would have been much much easier to do this before the cab and box were mounted on the frame. But you only live once and well everything can’t be the easy route. We did manage to get some bolts in place enough to support it without the straps and hoist. However we so far cannot get the two large bolts and spacer washers to line up. They are off about a 1/16” of an inch. I’m thinking I may have to use my porta power to force the case over just that little bit.

Lastly is there supposed to be some kind of a spacer where I’ve circled in he picture?

[Lynn Eades]

Jordan, I think a lot of the spicer seals are made of cork. The join cut has a long overlap as I remember. (remembering is not such a reliable function as it has been)
Are your spacer washers in the right place? If you took them from the lower mount and put them on the top mounts, does it all line up then?