Generator M5 1942

[Vic Eaton]

FOUND GENERATOR SET
Just found the following set
UNIT A.C.GASOLINE
ELECTRIC GENERATING M5
3KVA /25 VOLTS 3 PHASE 60 AND 50 CYCLES
WEIGHT 808 K No 23809- FAM
THE HOBART MANUFACTURING CO
TROY OHIO USA YEAR OF MANUFACTURE 1942
BULK HEAD PLATE

ENGINE BLOCK 1115023 7XB
HURCULES MOTOR CORP CANTON OHIO
MODEL ZB2 5 OVER EIGHT -3
MAINTAINANCE 15
ENGINE PLATE
Any info on this folks

[Vic Eaton]

HELLO ALL
Regarding this generater i have come accross some one has said it could be an american field hospital power unit its about
six feet long and three feet high and is completly enclosed and must weigh over a quater of a ton its mounted on skids but doesnt seem to have any lifting points if any one out there can
help with the ID on this unit i would be most greatful
thank you . vic eaton

[Vic Eaton]

OH DEAR
Dont tell me im the only one with a world war two generater
there must be someone out there generater mad. please step forward . vic eaton.

[dalent]

Vic,
I have a WWII generator, but it is a 15 KW set made for the Signal Corp. It is single phase 120/240, has a overhead valve Continental 6 cylinder engine, a Century generator, the tag says it was designed by Western Electric, and was built by the Duplex Truck Company in Michigan. It was manufactured in Sept 1943.
I'm a little confused by the 25 volts 3 Phase that you refer to, could you clarify that? And if you send me a couple of pictures of it I will see if I have any paper on it.

[Robert Dabkowski]

Vic, since it isn't really CMP or Canadian related I think that you would be better off posting your generator question to "mil-veh@mil-veh.org " since there are many more yanks at that list. Robert in Toronto

[Vic Eaton]

HELLO DALENT
Thanks so much for the reply WOW! thats a powerful gen
better make sure you dont get a shock from that sorry about the wrong info regarding volts on this gen on the plate is the following JOB NO RP503 KVA 3 VOLTS 240/415 CYCLES 50/60

TYPE H/P POWER FACTOR 1 AMPS 4.1 RPM 1000 KW 2.5
PHASE 3 RATING CONTINOUS AND ITS MADE IN ENGLAND
ALL THE REST IS USA MADE I will get some pictures done for you land put on here not sure where you are in the world but again many thanks for the reply vic uk .
PS HAVE UNCOVERED THE LETTERS
USE WHITE GAS ONLY NEAR THE FUEL FILLER .

[Vic Eaton]

HELLO ROBERT IN TORONTO
Thanks for the reply yes i realised it was on the wrong
site but there doesnt seem to be one for generators so took a chance thanks for the site you sugested i will try that. but did get to talk to DALENT so didnt waste my time . ill have a look at the down town traffic cameras there in TORONTO OH! yes we can see all the unopened CMP spares boxes you have hidden over there . vic uk .

[Vic Eaton]

Here are some pics

[Vic Eaton]

Here are some pics

[Barry Churcher]

Hi Vic
I have a generator that looks very close to yours. I believe it is post war. It is powered by a four cylinder Hercules engine. I will dig it out of the snow on the weekend and get the data plate. Another generator I have is missing the shrouds and I can't tell what kind of four cylinder flathead it is. It is a bit smaller than yours and kind of an odd shape. I also have 2 American generators. One is powered by a four cylinder Wisconsin and is kind of neat. Brian Gough and I saw one exactly like it at Hershey one year. The guy made a trailer out of it and towed it behind his motorhome and actually used it for power. My last generator is in the chicken ranch ( Martin can explain ) so I can't remember much about the engine. I think it is powered by a three cylinder Koehler.
Dirk Leegwater had a real nice British generator trailer for sale but it is gone now. If I remember it was on the same chassis as my general service wooden British trailer. The last generator item I have is a British Petter engine that was used to power a generator. It is in a frame that can be caried by two men. It is a horizontally oppossed two cylinder. Unfortunately I don't have the generator. I am in the middle of restoring the motor now. The neat thing about it is that it was used at Camp X in Whitby. If you want any photos I can email them to Martin. I can't seem to post photos here.
Regards Barry

[Richard Farrant]

Originally posted by Barry C
The last generator item I have is a British Petter engine that was used to power a generator. It is in a frame that can be caried by two men. It is a horizontally oppossed two cylinder. Unfortunately I don't have the generator.

Barry,
This is the Petter Universal power unit. They were fitted with a flexible drive coupling, is yours like that? There purpose was to provide power to rafts or pontoons for ferrying vehicles across rivers. Somewhere, I have a British Army training manual showing one in use. I think it drove something similar to the bottom end of an outboard motor, ie. a steerable prop unit. While I was working in REME workshops, probably in the late 1970's, we had these come in for periodic checks and service. The data plate usually has the letter "P" on it and not the whole name, Petter. It may well be that they could drive generators as well, perhaps pumps also, this could be why they were designated "Universal".

Richard

[Richard Farrant]

Barry,
Just found the manual, on water crossing equipment. Photos are not good enough to reproduce but the engines can be seen. Fitted in particular, to Close Support Raft, Class 9 Mark 2 and Raft, Class 50/60, which shows a Churchill being ferried, on this raft, 4 propulsion units are used.

Richard

[Vic Eaton]

HELLO BARRY
Good to hear from you yes i would love to see some pictures
of your generators this one is almost complete the parts missing are the dynamowhich appears to be driven from a gearbox
on the side of the engine the voltage control is missing ( increas/
decreas) i have to make a new silencer box apart from those things its all there ,sorry about the lack of pictures six were put on but only two got on so we will be doing those again im not clever enough yet to put stuff on my self the engine is in nice cond the oil is clean oh i have to find a fan belt for it then well try and run it i would imagine generators were in demand in the forties i cant remember any one being able to generate thier own power back then . all i remember is coal fires and oil lamps
it will be interesting to see if you gen with hercules eng is the same as this one then it may tell me what the dynamo should look like HAVE A GOOD CHRISTMAS BARRY
REGARDS VIC .

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

Vic
The Diamond T with the machinary workshop body was set up for 115V DC and the distribution panels were in the van while the gen set was external..25 KW
The lathes and drill presses, bench grinders etc were typically 1-3 HP at 110-115 VDC ..
The power pig of the lot was the Cowan Circular saw which sported a 32" circular blade and drew 112AMPS DC at 115V DC..
It was rated at 15 HP with a 115V-140 AMP DC Controller..
I have the manuals on the H and RE 25K machinary vans but not listed yet on my web site..
FYI..

[Bill Mulholland]

Hi Alex; My favourite subj - DiamondTs - you are correct in stating only the "Mach H" and the "Mach RE 25KW" used ground power from a 25 KW gen tlr. The "Mach M" had a 4cyl Willys(Continental) hooked up to either an ONAN or Hobart generator mounted under the workbench in the Lindsay house type body. It could however be hooked up to the 25KW genny.
Cheers, Bill

[Alex Blair (RIP)]

Hi Bill
Yes I just got the manuals showing the layout and all the installed parts and pieces and the electrical distribution and wiring manuals for the H and the RE25KW ..It also has a complete tools list and parts numbers with the various lathes,grinders ,presses etc..
A must for Diamond "T" freaks......ah,lovers..
The power was from an external source..

[Barry Churcher]

Hi Vic
I am going to try and add a photo here again. Yeserday I somehow lost my whole post to you and Richard. This is the generator we saw at Hershey Pennsylvania. It was taken by my official photographer, Brian Gough. He always seems to be prepared to help me. He has the camera, he has my business cards, etc. etc. Maybe I am a tad bit disorganized.
Barry

[Barry Churcher]

Hi Richard
Thanks for the info on the Petter. I have tried for some time to get anything about it. Mine is a Universal Petter, 8 horsepower (UP-8) as you describe. It does have the flexible drive on the end. When I am finished the restoration I will post a photo here. Hah!
Now you have given me something else to look for. I have an excuse to go back to Beltring and look for that lower unit you describe. Mine was specifically used to power some kind of small generator at the spy camp in Whitby. Camp X is where Ian Fleming trained and Fairbairn was an instructor. Read " A Man Called Intrepid ". We have some questions as to why mine was in Canada. Did they outfit the camp with British materials because that early in the war there wasn't a Canadian equivalent? Maybe it was sent here as a sample for Canadian production and it just found it's way to the camp. It would be interesting to find out.
Barry

[Richard Farrant]

Originally posted by Barry C
Hi Richard
Mine is a Universal Petter, 8 horsepower (UP-8) as you describe. It does have the flexible drive on the end. Now you have given me something else to look for. I have an excuse to go back to Beltring and look for that lower unit you describe. Mine was specifically used to power some kind of small generator at the spy camp in Whitby. We have some questions as to why mine was in Canada. Did they outfit the camp with British materials because that early in the war there wasn't a Canadian equivalent? Maybe it was sent here as a sample for Canadian production and it just found it's way to the camp. It would be interesting to find out.

Barry,
I have just found a website featuring a retored one, ex-Australian Army, take a look to see if it is the same as yours;

http://www.oldengine.org/members/kmo...es/Engeng.html

Click on the photos to bring to screen size.

If you need to look up any info, the model number is "PU 8". they were built up until 1945 and the last engine number was F24200.

As I said before, although the only use I know of, is for powering propulsion units, they may well have been linked to generators and that is why it was at Whitby, on the other hand, why have them separate. It is more common for a genny and engine to be together in a frame. Any idea what the generator was, power, make, etc.?

Richard

[Vic Eaton]

HELLO ALEX
Well me thinking i had the only WWII Generator has now been blown right out the window, its true there is always someone with more and better and its very interesting to hear
whats out there i can see why DC was used owing to starting under heavy loads i have a lath that martin tells me was used
on the GMC MACH TRUCK its a LA BLONDE 15 inch motors and generators have always interested me i only wish i knew more about them so am hoping did you know that the biggest electric motor made was 40 000 HP BUILT BE WESTINGHOUSE IN THE GOOD OLD USA I WONDER WHO HAS THAT !!
PS its last resting place was WRIGHT FIELD .

[Vic Eaton]

HI ALEX
Some of the larger generators i have seen mounted on
fairground trucks ill have a good look at those in the future and of course the diamond T was a favourite for pulling three or more trailors as i have seen didnt even have a camara in those days
i remember standing with my uncle in TENBY SOUTH WALES

[martineaton]

Hi barry,

Here are the pictures you sent me, it looks the same as dads one to me.

[martineaton]

picture

[martineaton]

picture

[Vic Eaton]

HELLO BARRY
Martin has just put your pictures on and that gen is the same model in all respects as mine now i can see more things that are missing , the lifting eyes the little bag inside the front
door all the guages are the same i can now see the voltage regulator knob thats going to want some finding this internet
is amazing , what also amazes me is the people that remove parts from these things and never put them back i hope you wont mind me asking sometimes what goes where as i try to piece mine together again things like the lifting eyes i can make but i would like to see whats on the other side of that voltage regulator knob and what its wired to many thanks for sending the picts i didnt think i was going to see another one thats for sure ill get some close up shots of mine so we can compare them
regards vic uk..

[Vic Eaton]

HELLO AGAIN BARRY
Just looking at that exhaust elbo i would have sworn that
had been made up long after it was made with those welded ribs
to create a bend but the one here is absolutly the same including the silencer box what is the dynamo like on the other side is it
anything like a jeep if so i could get one of those if not the hunt will be on along with the chorehorse gens for the radio truck not to mention the arctic heater. im in the process of building one of those but it will be gas fired but in all other respect will look the same again regards vic uk..

[Barry Churcher]

Hi Vic
I would be happy to take any photos or measurements that you need. I have used my generator to power a drill just to make sure it works. I would like to find out what the proper exhaust looked like on the outside. I don't think that plumbers pipe pointing down at the battery was original. What chore horse do you need? I may have an extra of the smaller one. I also have one in an unopened wooden crate. It may be new or it may be rebuilt. It may also be full of bricks! I got it from a very reliable source though. Brian Gough has sent me photos of the generator at Hershey that is like my other one. I will see if Martin will be so kind as to post them. Now tell me the truth. Is it Martin posting the photos or is it Sally doing it for him?
Merry Christmas from Canada
Barry

[Barry Churcher]

Hi Richard
Yes the Petter in the photos is the same as mine. It is missing a couple of the engine shrouds but that better shows the engine. Mine will be pretty well covered up. Mine also has a wodden tool box on the top. The one in the photo may be wooden and just has a metal top. I rather like the metal top. I sure would like to know what went in that box. It has quite a few brackets for holding things. I have had the box reproduced by a friend of mine. He is an old world Dutch carpenter. He even exactly duplicated the home made dovetails on the original. It looks so good I don't think I will paint that part green.
As for the generator I have no information. Only what I was told by the guy I got it from who was at the camp. They did many strange things out in Lake Ontario so it could have been there for powering some kind of raft and when that part was finished they gave it alternate duties. What you say about the generators usually being one unit also holds true. It was stored in the same room as Hydra but it sure doesn't have enough power to supply anything in there I would say. I will try to get hold of the chap I got it from. He was very closed mouthed about the camp as was everyone who was involved. Many will take their official secrets to the grave.
Merry Christmas from Canada
Barry

[Vic Eaton]

HI THERE BARRY
Thanks for the reply, yes the exhaust looks like standard plumbing bits but mine is the same although mine didnt have a bend to send it down it just came straight out the front my silencer box was split from rust so i cut it in half to look at the inside and it consists of four plates with holes drilled in the shape of a star but not in line with each other just moved over a little in each plate im going to have to make one so i will make two one for you and one for me . the chore horse gens we have to find are the little ones that sat in the rear of the radio truck
if you look at MARTINS entry you will see the pictures that rolf sent of the one he has regards vic ..

[Richard Farrant]

Originally posted by Barry C
The one in the photo may be wooden and just has a metal top. I rather like the metal top. I sure would like to know what went in that box. It has quite a few brackets for holding things.

Hi Barry,
The main thing that went in the box was the starting handle. I would imagine also, it would have had a plug spanner and spare plugs also. These types of equipment (ie charging sets, gennys, etc.) usually came with its own small tool kit and a few spares along with a manual, so that the operator could maintain it.

Richard