M10 17 pdr S237818

kevinT · #1 19-02-08, 20:39

Over on Missing Lynx there is a still grab ( under the posting of Screen grabs ) of a knocked out M10 17 pdr. The WD serial is S237818 and a name "LEILAN" ( this could be a partial name ). This M10 17 pdr is listed in the great posting earlier by Tony Viste and is listed as being one 5th Anti - Tank Regiment, Royal Canadian Artillery.
Does anyone have any further information or is able to confirm the name?
Thanks for anu help.

Cheers
Kevin

John McGillivray · #2 19-02-08, 22:34

“Leilan” is a girl’s name.

L troop of the 5th A/T Regt RCA was destroyed near Quesnay Wood with the lost of all four of its 17pdr M-10s, on the 10th (?) of August, 1944.

From the book South Albertas (p117)

“It is not known why B Squadron was withdrawn from St. Hilaire Farm but in any case Swatty decided to replace them with the troop of M-10 self-propelled 17-pdr. guns from 5th Anti-Tank Regiment assigned to the SAR. This unit's heavy anti-tank weapons were normally allotted, on a troop basis, to the other units in 4th Division for defensive purposes, the self-propelled equipment going to the armoured regiments, the towed pieces to the infantry battalions.

“By this time the Recce Troop had worked out a safer route to the farm and L Troop of the 5th Regiment was sent that way in the early afternoon guided by their troop leader in a jeep. Unfortunately they made a wrong turn and moved too close to Quesnay Wood - within minutes all four guns were brewed up by AP fire and only one crew escaped. The commander of the last vehicle in action, a Sergeant McAlinden, "was last seen firing his gun while his M-10 was burning" and received a posthumous Mention in Dispatches. The troop leader survived and drove back to Langannerie, where he ran into Captain Jay Moreton of B Squadron. Jay had "heard the firing going on and shortly after a guy turned up and ... said his four tanks were gone and he was just a young fellow and he was weeping all over the place." There was nothing that Jay or anyone else could do to comfort the man.”

marco · #3 23-02-08, 17:44

Hello Kevin and John,

Hereby two other photo's from M10'S.
The first one is S-230553 named JOYCE II.
Location is Bergen op Zoom in Holland in Oktober 1944.

The quality isn't to good

Source:
http://www.markiezenhof.nl/

Marco

marco · #4 23-02-08, 17:49

And the other one is S237843 named JEAN.
Same location and source.

Also, I can advice anyone interested in the South Alberta Regiment to have a look in this photoarchive.

Go to "beeldbank" (=photoarchive) and search on "bevrijding" (liberation).

Succes,

Marco

kevinT · #5 23-02-08, 23:09

Hi Marco,

Thanks for posting those. I have a doubt about the WD serial for S230553.
According to the list I have S230470 - S230769 was for M7 105mm howitzers and S230770 - S231069 was for M10's.
As you say it is not a good image, so do you think it is possible that 553 could be 883 or 993?
Can anyone else make it out? Sadly my steam powered computer is unable to get a good copy of the image.

Cheers
Kevin

marco · #6 24-02-08, 16:44

Hi Kevin,

Yes, that is possible.
The best I could make out of it is S-230553 but it might be S-230883 as well.

Best regards,

Marco

Mike Slusar · #7 21-09-17, 22:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by kevinT

Over on Missing Lynx there is a still grab ( under the posting of Screen grabs ) of a knocked out M10 17 pdr. The WD serial is S237818 and a name "LEILAN" ( this could be a partial name ). This M10 17 pdr is listed in the great posting earlier by Tony Viste and is listed as being one 5th Anti - Tank Regiment, Royal Canadian Artillery.
Does anyone have any further information or is able to confirm the name?
Thanks for anu help.

Cheers
Kevin

Hello Kevin

I have info about this tank, I can't confirm the serial number but My father was a tank sergeant in the 5th A/Tk regt RCA. I think this was his tank. Would really like to talk to you.

Cheers !
Mike

Mike Slusar · #8 21-09-17, 22:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by John McGillivray

“Leilan” is a girl’s name.

L troop of the 5th A/T Regt RCA was destroyed near Quesnay Wood with the lost of all four of its 17pdr M-10s, on the 10th (?) of August, 1944.

From the book South Albertas (p117)

“It is not known why B Squadron was withdrawn from St. Hilaire Farm but in any case Swatty decided to replace them with the troop of M-10 self-propelled 17-pdr. guns from 5th Anti-Tank Regiment assigned to the SAR. This unit's heavy anti-tank weapons were normally allotted, on a troop basis, to the other units in 4th Division for defensive purposes, the self-propelled equipment going to the armoured regiments, the towed pieces to the infantry battalions.

“By this time the Recce Troop had worked out a safer route to the farm and L Troop of the 5th Regiment was sent that way in the early afternoon guided by their troop leader in a jeep. Unfortunately they made a wrong turn and moved too close to Quesnay Wood - within minutes all four guns were brewed up by AP fire and only one crew escaped. The commander of the last vehicle in action, a Sergeant McAlinden, "was last seen firing his gun while his M-10 was burning" and received a posthumous Mention in Dispatches. The troop leader survived and drove back to Langannerie, where he ran into Captain Jay Moreton of B Squadron. Jay had "heard the firing going on and shortly after a guy turned up and ... said his four tanks were gone and he was just a young fellow and he was weeping all over the place." There was nothing that Jay or anyone else could do to comfort the man.”

Hello John

August 10th is correct. My Father Cliff was a sergeant for L troop of 5th A/Tk regt. RCA. All four M10's were destroyed. The story from "South Albertas" is very interesting. I have two other accounts of that "battle" one from his commanding officer and one from one of the soldiers who witnessed it first hand.

I am putting together all the info I can about that day. My father was taken prisoner and spent 9 months as a P.O.W. in Fallingbostel.

Looking forward to hearing from you sir.

Cheers !
Mike Slusar

John McGillivray · #9 22-09-17, 04:01

14th Bty 5th A/T Regt. War Diary

http://heritage.canadiana.ca/view/oo...17/566?r=1&s=3

John McGillivray · #10 24-09-17, 14:27

From Colonel G.W.L. Nicholson’s book “The Gunners of Canada” Vol II, page 322.

“Another of Lt.-Col. Harkness’s batteries, the 14th Anti-Tank Battery, suffered a heavy loss when one of its troops was almost completely wiped out when it missed its way and ran unto an enemy trap at Quesnay Wood. Only one of the gun crews escaped, and all four M-10’s were destroyed. It was a regrettable incident that served to point up the importance of good map reading in military operations. Courageous and devoted to duty to the end, Sgt. M.J. McAlinden was last seen firing his gun while his mount burned. He was posthumously awarded a Mention in Despatched.”

Mike Slusar · #11 25-09-17, 02:12

Hello John

Thanks for the link and information, I have seen that page of the war diary before. Its nice that they are readily available online. I was not aware of the book reference. I now have another avenue of research, thank you so much for that. Sergeant McAlinden was definitely part of my fathers "L troop". I have that info from his commanding officer Lt. Jack Connors. Jack wrote his memoirs but to the best of my knowledge it never got published.

I'm really interested in locating the photo that Kevin T refers to in a previous post. My fathers tank was called LEILANI so i'm almost positive he is describing a picture of my dads burnt out M10

Sincerely, Mike

kevinT · #12 30-09-17, 19:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Slusar

Hello John

Thanks for the link and information, I have seen that page of the war diary before. Its nice that they are readily available online. I was not aware of the book reference. I now have another avenue of research, thank you so much for that. Sergeant McAlinden was definitely part of my fathers "L troop". I have that info from his commanding officer Lt. Jack Connors. Jack wrote his memoirs but to the best of my knowledge it never got published.

I'm really interested in locating the photo that Kevin T refers to in a previous post. My fathers tank was called LEILANI so i'm almost positive he is describing a picture of my dads burnt out M10

Sincerely, Mike

Hi Mike,

I was having trouble with the search option on Missing Lynx so I put in a request for the original poster, Michael Kenny to repost it. It is there now showing the name and census number although it only shows the name as LEILAN.
Anyway I hope this is what you are looking for.

cheers

Kevin

Mike Slusar · #13 01-10-17, 08:37

Hello Kevin

Thank you so very much for this. Up until a few weeks ago i never knew this picture existed, then i stumbled onto your post from 2008. I have been piecing together my fathers war history and have always wondered if pictures would surface somewhere. As you can imagine i have viewed countless pictures of M10s over the years since my father passed away (2007) without finding anything related to his regiment.

The picture shows something like debris or foliage covering the far end of the lettering so i'm positive that the name on the tank is LEILANI. This is confirmed in a book written by my dads commanding officer Lt J.F. Connor 14th Bty 5th A/Tk Regt RCA

The book is called World War 2 - The Way I saw It, and it states the following
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Several months earlier we had decided to give names to our M10s. The lettering was uniform, six inches in height and painted on each side of the hull. The names had to be those of ladies beginning with the letter "L". They would be of the crews own choosing.

L 1, Sgt Slusar's M10 was named LEILANI
L 2, Sgt Garrah's M10 was named LAURA
L 3, Sgt McAlinden's M10 was named LENA

The only female name beginning with "L" that Sgt Gray could come up with was LUPINO. Not a Christian name but he and his crew were quite satisfied with it, so L4 bore Lupino on each side of the hull.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As you already know when we discover more evidence to support our research it uncovers more leads and clues that leave us asking more questions. My questions are who took this photo? Was it an allie or axis photographer? Where would I begin the search for the original photo? If this photo was taken their could be more photos of the rest of "L" troop.Where would i be able to view paperwork confirming the census number is attached to the 5th A/Tk Regt?

Once again Thank you for your kind efforts in getting this photo reposted.

Cheers

kevinT · #14 01-10-17, 10:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Slusar

Hello Kevin

Thank you so very much for this. Up until a few weeks ago i never knew this picture existed, then i stumbled onto your post from 2008. I have been piecing together my fathers war history and have always wondered if pictures would surface somewhere. As you can imagine i have viewed countless pictures of M10s over the years since my father passed away (2007) without finding anything related to his regiment.

The picture shows something like debris or foliage covering the far end of the lettering so i'm positive that the name on the tank is LEILANI. This is confirmed in a book written by my dads commanding officer Lt J.F. Connor 14th Bty 5th A/Tk Regt RCA

The book is called World War 2 - The Way I saw It, and it states the following
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Several months earlier we had decided to give names to our M10s. The lettering was uniform, six inches in height and painted on each side of the hull. The names had to be those of ladies beginning with the letter "L". They would be of the crews own choosing.

L 1, Sgt Slusar's M10 was named LEILANI
L 2, Sgt Garrah's M10 was named LAURA
L 3, Sgt McAlinden's M10 was named LENA

The only female name beginning with "L" that Sgt Gray could come up with was LUPINO. Not a Christian name but he and his crew were quite satisfied with it, so L4 bore Lupino on each side of the hull.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As you already know when we discover more evidence to support our research it uncovers more leads and clues that leave us asking more questions. My questions are who took this photo? Was it an allie or axis photographer? Where would I begin the search for the original photo? If this photo was taken their could be more photos of the rest of "L" troop.Where would i be able to view paperwork confirming the census number is attached to the 5th A/Tk Regt?

Once again Thank you for your kind efforts in getting this photo reposted.

Cheers

Hi Mike,
Try this link to the Allied WWII section of Missing-Lynx.com, Michael Kenny who first posted the screen grab back in 2008 has kindly reposted the images along with the links to the German film they came from.
www.network54.com/Forum/47208/message/1506765006
From various sources and contributions over the years this is what I have managed to compile for M10’s of Canadian 5th Anti-Tank Regiment.
J Troop
S235195 J2, S235180 J3
K Troop 14 Battery
S237843 JEAN, S290553 JOYCE II
L Troop 14 Battery
S237818 L1 LEILANI, L2 LAURA, L3 LENA, L4 LUPINO
Other M10’s ( although they could be M10 17pdrs )
S230842, 230984, 235185, 235190
M10 17 pdrs
S235062, 235063, 235163, 235164, 235175, 235184, 235192, 235201, 235205, 235208, 237814, 237823, 237825, 237827, 237829, 237836, 237839, 237842, 237890, 237894, 237897, 237904, 290446, 290473, 290517, 290560, 290625, 290684, 290725, 290735, 290819
I also have a list of Crusader Gun Towers.
If you or anyone else can add any names or numbers or see any errors please let me know.

Cheers

Kevin

Mike Slusar · #15 09-10-17, 03:14

Hi Kevin,

Thank you for the amazing piece of footage. In all my years of researching my father's military history, I have never come across any video or photographic evidence of the day he and his M10 crew were attacked. I am blown away.

The added bonus was the short piece of footage that comes after the burning M10's. The solider you see facing the camera and then turning away is my father, Sgt. Slusar. I showed my family and sisters and they are all very appreciative of this community of WWII enthusiasts.

Please, if anyone has any more information to add, continue this post.

I am also available to answer any questions anyone might have.

kevinT · #16 09-10-17, 22:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Slusar

Hi Kevin,

Thank you for the amazing piece of footage. In all my years of researching my father's military history, I have never come across any video or photographic evidence of the day he and his M10 crew were attacked. I am blown away.

The added bonus was the short piece of footage that comes after the burning M10's. The solider you see facing the camera and then turning away is my father, Sgt. Slusar. I showed my family and sisters and they are all very appreciative of this community of WWII enthusiasts.

Please, if anyone has any more information to add, continue this post.

I am also available to answer any questions anyone might have.

Hi Mike,

I have posted a thank you to Michael Kenny over on the Missing Lynx Allied WWII forum for re-posting the image and adding the film clips.
It makes all those hours of searching through hundreds and hundreds of images and watching hour upon hour of newsreels all worth while when you find something like this. it doesn't happen often but it is nice when it does.
Glad our paths crossed and pleased to have helped in a way.

cheers

Kevin

Mike Slusar · #17 11-06-18, 18:45

Hello
Just found out that this link to You tube is no longer working, apparently due to copyright issues. I have seen other you tube videos of this newsreel but the quality is just not as good. I am currently in contact with the German archive to see if I can get a DVD copy. This piece of film is amazing and is something to help preserve my fathers military history.

Thanks again to all the people who helped me find this film clip.

Best Regards, Mike

Mike Slusar · #18 05-03-19, 23:39

Once again I just have to says thanks a lot to all who have contributed to this thread and story. I was able to borrow a DVD (newsreel #730) from the German Bundesarchiv and it was a much higher resolution, revealing much more detail, it allowed me to confirm another detail about that day. The DVD revealed a soldier lying down in the background behind my father. The soldier is injured and has a covering over his right leg. These are details that get missed by watching you tube versions of these war films. They get copied and recopied so many times that they lose some of the important details.

The injured Sgt Garrah became a good friend of my Dad and I have a hand written letter detailing the events of that day. I have been aware of the letter for about ten years now, but now I have a film clip that documents it !! Wow, truly blessed to have this much info. I have registered on the Axis history forum to investigate more of what happened from the German side that day.
https://forum.axishistory.com/viewto...40659#p2192046
Thanks again, continuing to dig !!

Mike Slusar · #19 28-09-24, 09:39

Hi Folks,
So many of you have been very helpful in my search for info on my Father troop movement in Normandy in the summer of 44. I was wondering if anyone can help me to find links to a couple of more divisions. The 51st Highlander division, and the Lincoln and Welland division for a time frame of August 1 to August 15.. my fathers troop (5th Anti tank) was in support of these divisions, and reading their diaries could give me some more clues as to where his path through Normandy was taken. Thanks for your time! OK

Dan Martel · #20 28-09-24, 16:04

I don't have a link, but the book Because We Are Canadians by Charles Kipp tells about his time with the Lincoln and Welland Regiment from Normandy onwards. You can probably get a copy from your local library.

As for the 51st Highland Division, you can't swing a dead cat without finding information about them. Lots of books and lots of internet links.