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  #121  
Old 30-06-23, 09:27
tankbarrell tankbarrell is offline
Adrian Barrell
 
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8000 hours. I restored my Sherman from a range wreck to fully restored, including rebuilding the engine in a little over half that.
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  #122  
Old 30-06-23, 12:20
Hanno Spoelstra's Avatar
Hanno Spoelstra Hanno Spoelstra is offline
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Default No judgement

Quote:
Originally Posted by tankbarrell View Post
8000 hours. I restored my Sherman from a range wreck to fully restored, including rebuilding the engine in a little over half that.
Compare the result of 8,000 hours of work spent on CT152655 (left) and a little over half that on Adrian's T-146309 (right, and follow this link):

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  #123  
Old 12-10-23, 18:14
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Hanno Spoelstra Hanno Spoelstra is offline
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See these interior scans of Holy Roller:

http://fanshawetv.ca/holy-roller
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  #124  
Old 12-10-23, 21:07
Ed Storey Ed Storey is offline
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Default Holy Roller

More like what is left of the interior after 'restoration and preservation'. Heartwrenching to see the butchery that was done in the name of preserving history.
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  #125  
Old 13-10-23, 04:50
Bob Carriere Bob Carriere is offline
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Default Even the best museums strip the inside.......

Did you ever take a peek inside the Churchill bridging tank at the CDN war museum????

It has been gutted......totally....... engine, ramp firing mechanism, seats, fire fighting extinguisher system, bins, engine bulk head, external fording air and exhaust extensions, etc......... and "they" claim that was the condition it was in when they got it.... no parts saved in the warehouse..... you would think the complete power pack of the flat 12 cyl. Bedford engine could have been saved and displayed on a stand!!!!..BS

I have pictures of all the inside when it was found in Kemptville....... along with a twin brother....... and I was there when it was moved to the Annex on Sussex and dumped in the late Friday afternoon traffic on Sussex Street.

I did save one of the track links that was laying around ......also there were the heavy 3 inch armoured cables used to fire the rockets and extra girders to hold the front ramps partly erect.....and boxes of heavy bolts. The second Churchill tank was cut up for scrap the following Spring along with the whole scrap yard.........but that was the yard owner's prerogative.

Sweet memories ......... Early Winter 72/73
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  #126  
Old 13-10-23, 23:51
Perry Kitson Perry Kitson is offline
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I have been around this project for a number of years, and after reading through the posts, I feel more correct information needs to be put forward.

Estimates were submitted to the Regiment for preservation ($60K to $70K), this included crane, trucking, sandblasting, painting, wheel and track replacement as well as properly removing the interior to be stored for possible use for a future restoration of the tank.
The estimate for restoration to running (not including rebuilding the fighting compartment) was $120K to $130K. This would obviously include rebuilding the entire drive train as well as radiators and electrical system.

The project was quickly taken over by individuals who did not want to see this machine restored to running. Interviews were done throwing out ridiculous sums of money said to be needed for the project. All BS.

Fanshawe College, Militex, General Dynamics, Facca Fasteners, Fastenal, Roestenberg Welding, Xtreme Metal Worx, and Industrial Tire, Rho Can Machine, here in London, in the end supplied all paint, sandblasting, fasteners, steel, some fabricating/machining, perishable tooling, gases, welding consumables and abrasives, work space and some transportation.

Last edited by Perry Kitson; 14-10-23 at 00:23.
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  #127  
Old 14-10-23, 00:36
Perry Kitson Perry Kitson is offline
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The T41 rubber block track that was on the tank before preservation, was actually fitted to the tank in Borden after it's return from Europe. Photo's show T54 steel chevron track worn on leaving the vehicle park in the Netherlands.
The road wheels had the tires removed and new rims pressed on, preserving the original spoked and solid wheel configuration.
As for labour hours committed to the project, it would not amount to more than 2,200 hours actually spent on the tank itself, and that was with mostly non or semi skilled people doing the work. I have no idea how the project managers came up with 8,000 hours. Probably the same place they got $500,000 to restore to running.
I personally think this project was a once in a lifetime opportunity that was terribly squandered with all the help and support it had from companies in the area. Donations of material, parts, equipment and work would probably be around the $120,000 mark.

Last edited by Perry Kitson; 14-10-23 at 00:51.
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  #128  
Old 14-10-23, 00:45
Perry Kitson Perry Kitson is offline
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Crane costs were in excess of $45,000 for the lift out of and into the park, (resulting from the city's refusal to let the crane into the park) a lift from the street with a 400 ton crane was required.
A running battle with terminology on this project was an issue. The managers always called it a "restoration", when it was only a gut and preserve.

Last edited by Perry Kitson; 14-10-23 at 00:51.
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  #129  
Old 06-12-23, 22:58
GaryC GaryC is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Parker (RIP) View Post
Because all the interior has been stripped out. Notice the temporary 2 by 4's for a seat. I also wonder what all the brass screws and washers are for on the right side.
The screws and washers were to mount a plaque inside.
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  #130  
Old 06-12-23, 23:07
GaryC GaryC is offline
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I've read through the thread and to those of you that have could have done better, well done you. Perry's statements are accurate and his passion is correct. What many fail to grasp were the variables we were up against. We didn't own the tank, no one wanted to make it a running tank, we could have very easily we made all the moving parts move, and to the time of the one CO who asked the question why don't we...NOTHING would have been done - zip nada. HOLY ROLLER is fortunate that there was a perfect storm (to a point). The volunteer force was 95% people with no military background and they gave up every Saturday and then some. A few businesses felt they needed to help the project. Overall the city doesn't care, the Regiment doesn't care and the Association cannot maintain HOLY ROLLER. So, we could have left it there to rot or do something. The CWM knew where and what HOLY ROLLER was. A complete travesty for it going back into the park, I agree. But if nothing else it made headlines, it got the attention of a few museums that showed interest (all of a sudden). So, money wasted? An argument that isn't worth it, we stopped the degradation for awhile, which gives us the time to try to save it, to move it to an appropriate location. That in my viewpoint is the CWM. So, the hard part is keeping the pressure on to move this national icon. If people are that concerned, start writing to the mayor of the city and put the facts on paper and continue to write. Me, I'm chipping away from the inside.

Last edited by GaryC; 06-12-23 at 23:21.
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  #131  
Old 09-12-23, 16:36
Hanno Spoelstra's Avatar
Hanno Spoelstra Hanno Spoelstra is offline
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Default "So, we could have left it there to rot or do something"

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryC View Post
HOLY ROLLER is fortunate that there was a perfect storm (to a point). The volunteer force was 95% people with no military background and they gave up every Saturday and then some. A few businesses felt they needed to help the project. Overall the city doesn't care, the Regiment doesn't care and the Association cannot maintain HOLY ROLLER. So, we could have left it there to rot or do something. The CWM knew where and what HOLY ROLLER was.
Hello Gary,

Thanks for chiming in and letting us hear from someone on the inside of this story. From what I read, it was a wonder anything happened to Holy Roller at all. It seems more organisations do not care than the other way around, which is a pity to hear. So hats off to the volunteers and the local businesses who stopped the detoriation of this historic tank. Here's hoping better judgement will previal and that Holy Roller will be preserved inside sometime in the future.
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