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Dear MLU contributors!
I have received much valuable information from both the Armour and the Softskin fora and in a number of different threads. An effort to sum up the armoured vehicles of the Royal Netherlands East Indies Army (KNIL) follows: 1. In December 1937 four Tanks Vickers-Carden-Loyd (VCL)arrived on Java. 2 Light Tanks M/1934 and 2 Amphibious Tanks M/1931. With these the Proefavdeling Vechtwagens (Tanks Trials Unit) was organized in Bandoeng 15 December 1937. This unit belonged to the Infantry. 2. In 1938 arrived 12 Armoured Cars Alvis-Straussler AC3D. These were first held together in one unit, but later divided on four independant Platoons. In 1939 there were 1st Platoon (Meester Cornelis), 2nd Platoon (Bandoeng), 4th Platoon (Magelang) and 6th Platoon (Malang), each attached to a horse-mounted Cavalry Squadron. The ACs were manned by the Cavalry. 3. In 1939 the Proefavdeling Vechtwagens was redesigned Bataljon Vechtwagens (Tank Btn) in Bandoeng. This Btn was in 1940 divided on three Afdelingen (Which could sometimes mean Btn but also an unit of random size). These units were located in Bandoeng, Magelang and Malang. 4. When White Scoutcars M3A1 and Jeeps arrived on Java (When?) four mounted Cavalry Sqns were mechanized and also the Guards Cav Sqn (Cav LW) with the sultan´s of Jogjakarta (Sqn HQ and 1 Platoon) and Soerakarta (1 Platoon) respectively. The 5th Cav Sqn remained horse-mounted. 5. In December 1941 there were: 1st Cav Sqn (Cav 1) Meester-Cornelis, W Java (Mjr Wessel) 2nd Cav Sqn (Cav 2) Bandoeng, W Java (Cpt Romswinckel) 3rd Cav Sqn (Cav 3) Magelang, M Java (Cpt De Iongh) 4th Cav Sqn (Cav 4) Malang, E Java (Cpt de Boer) Each Sqn had HQ (1 White), 1 AC Plat (1 White, 3 Alvis), 2 Jeep Plats (x 11 Jeeps) and a HMG Plat (4 White) Guards Cav Sqn (Cav LW) in Jogjakarta-Soerakarta had no Alvis ACs, but it is known that it had at least 1 AC Plat White and also 2 (?) Jeep Plats. Possibly it had 10 White of which 3 as substitute for Alvis. (Cpt Lips) A 6th Cav Sqn (Cav 6) Malang, E Java (Commander not known) was a test and training unit. It was equipped with 9 Overvalwagens. 6. Before the Japanese invasion of Java on 1 March 1942, some vehicles arrived. 80 Marmon-Herrington Tanks CTLS (MH) onboard m/s Straat Soenda which ran aground and sank in Straat Soenda. The ship was salvaged and reached Tandjoeng Priok 28 January 1942. It is said that several of these Tanks had been under water for a week. In March 1942 most of them were still in crates. I know only of 7 operational in March 1942. 49 Marmon-Herrington Mk III ACs were delivered from South Africa. Two training units (Platoons) were formed with these ACs in Bandoeng. One manned by Infantry (Cpt van Dongen) and one by Cavalry (Cpt van Lier). 7. In December 1941 the Mobiele Eenheid (ME or Mob.E - A small Armoured Btn) was formed in Bandoeng. Btn CO (Cpt Wulfhorst) Btn HQ 1 White (1Lt de Wit, ADC) Tank Coy (Cpt Bakhuis) Coy HQ 3 VCL 1st Plat 7 MH (1Lt Christan) 2nd Plat 7 VCL (1Lt Cox) 3rd Plat 7 VCL (SMI Verboekend) SMI = Sergeant-Majoor-Instructeur Armoured Infantry Coy (Cpt Brendgen) HQ 1 Overvalwagen (OV) 1st Plat 5 OV (1Lt Rheasa) 2nd Plat 5 OV (1Lt Reep) 3rd Plat 5 OV (AOOI Kampers) AOOI = Adjudant-Onderofficier-Instructeur (Warrant Officer) Recce Plat (1Lt van Hellenberg Hubar) 3 White + 6 Jeep This Plat was in March 1942 sent to Group West (Batavia) and replaced by an improvised Platoon with 3 ACs Marmon-Herrington. 8. Armoured vehicles and carriers: TANKS VICKERS-CARDEN-LOYD (24). The two first delivered in 1937 were sent to Borneo (Singkawan II AFB) together with one of the Amphibious Tanks (The other was probably defect). 20 VCL M/1936 on Java of which 17 used in the ME. TANKS MARMON-HERRINGTON CTLS (80) 7 operational with ME. Rest under repair or unpacking. ARMOURED CARS ALVIS-STRAUSSLER (12) 3 with each Cav 1-4. ARMOURED CARS WHITE SCOUTCAR M3A1 (40) 1 HQ ME 3 Recce Plat ME (Afd Hubar) - to Group West 6 with each Cav 1-4 = 24. 10 (??) with Cav LW There are two unaccounted for. Where? ARMOURED CARS MARMON-HERRINGTON Mk III (49) 3 Recce Plat ME 17 Afd Ritman (= Training Plat van Lier??) 7 Afd van Dongen (Cpt van Dongen, ex-Training Plat Bandoeng) 3 Plat Heshusius (1Lt Heshusius, Cav) 5 Plat Punter (1Lt Punter) 9 Afd Tjepoe (Airfiend defence M Java) - from Cav Depot Salatiga?? 3 identified at Tjaroeban (E Java) - but wich unit? 2 identified at Tjiater (W Java) - but wich unit? Homepage "Henk of Holland" mentions 1st Sqn Bandoeng with HQ 2 MH and 3 Platoons X 4 MH and a 2nd Sqn Bandoeng (= Afd van Dongen?) with 10 MH. It seems however unlikely that these units were called 1st and 2nd Sqns since those units already existed. Probably the new units were Afdelingen. ARMOURED CARS OVERVALWAGEN (approx 90) 16 Inf Coy ME (Braat type) 9 6th Cav Sqn (Braat?) formed in Malang 7 Marines Btn Soerabaja (Braat) The rest distributed to various units. A total of 90 identified. VICKERS UTILITY CARRIERS (20) 6 with each APLA 1,2,4 and 6 (Heavy Weapons Coys) = 24. There were 30 AT-guns 47 mm M/1935 Böhler available, so there were not Carriers enough and substituded by trucks. So there are still white spots to fill in. I would appreciate all help I gan get to track down the Armoured Units of the KNIL. With kind regards, Stellan Bojerud
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Foxhole sends Last edited by Stellan Bojerud (RIP); 24-06-04 at 08:07. |
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In Australian War Memorial (awm.gov.au) i found several intreresting pictures (My computer does not allow me to attach them).
011779/38 HMT Orchades arriving Tandjoeng Priok harbour, West Java 12 Feb 1942 with Australian troops from the Mid-East. On the quay a Marmon-Herrington Armoured Car. Did it arrive on HMT Orchades? Are the trucks Australian? 043856 Elements of "Blackforce" at Arinem plantation, West Java. Several Marmon-Herrington:s. Making a stop on route for Bandoeng? Or an armoured unit serving with "Blakforce"?
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Foxhole sends Last edited by Stellan Bojerud (RIP); 23-06-04 at 08:33. |
#3
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HTH, Hanno Source: http://www.awm.gov.au/ ID Number: 011779/38 Summary: BATAVIA, JAVA. 1942-02-19. SOME OF THE TROOPS RETURNING FROM THE MIDDLE EAST PER THE TROOP TRANSPORT SHIP HMT ORCADES. THEY ARE IN THE BACK OF A TRUCK, PROBABLY HAVING JUST DISEMBARKED. RETAINED TO DEFEND THE DUTCH AIRFIELDS ON JAVA, THESE MEN BECAME KNOWN AS BLACKFORCE AND WERE TAKEN PRISONER OF WAR BY THE JAPANESE. |
#4
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Source: http://www.awm.gov.au/ ID Number: 043856 Summary: ARINEM PLANTATION, JAVA, 1942. MEMBERS OF 2/3 MACHINE GUNNERS, BLACKFORCE WITH THEIR ARMOURED CAR TRANSPORT AT ARINEM PLANTATION, JAVA, WHERE THEY WERE QUARTERED FOR SEVERAL DAYS. |
#5
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Thank you indeed, Hanno!
Humbers. I have not come across such ACs on Java before. Obviosly they were arriving together with "Blackforce": CO LtCol (Brig) Blackburn VC 2/3 MG Btn (Aus, LtCol Lyneham) 2/2 Pioneers (Aus, LtCol Williams) Guard Btn (Aus, Maj Champion de Crespigny) 2/6 Field Coy Engineers (Aus) 105 General Transport Coy (Aus) 2/3 Reserve Motor Transport Coy (Aus) B Sqn 3rd King´s Own Hussars (British, Maj William-Powett) 2nd Btn/131 Field Artillery (less one Bty) (US, LtCol Tharp) So where does the Humbers fit in? Were they in the 2/3 MG Btn? Quote: "With their armoured transport". Were the Humbers an organizational part of the 2/3 MG Btn or just used as means of transport? How many were they on Java? Thanks again
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Foxhole sends Last edited by Stellan Bojerud (RIP); 23-06-04 at 11:21. |
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I believe they belong to B Sqn 3rd King's Own Hussars. More later, I'm working on your initial list as well. Keep up the good work! H. |
#7
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About the Humbers:
Blackburn is said to have "scrounged up" some armour (including a "considerable" number of armoured cars and bren carriers that had arrived on Java). These were probably manned by Australians from his own force. I belieive the Humbers had come directly from England and were meant for the reinforcement of Malaya/Singapore. They arrived too late and were diverted to Java. There is no word on crew: these could have been on another ship and arrived possibly somewhere else (possibly ending up in Japanese captivity-there were more such cases). The MG battalion arrived btw without their MG's, these were also on a different ship. As the cars were probably meant for a full Recce regiment the number may have been the normal number of cars in such a regiment (how many? 48?). The Hussars had 16 Vickers Mk VI B's. They had briefly been in Oosthaven (Sumatra) and then were redeployed to Java where they served as Blackburn's tank company, seeing some fighting in Western-Java. You can find pictures of them on the AWM site: type in Oosthaven. Greetings Nuyt |
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Thank you very much, Hanno!
From the information you provide I draw the following conclusions: On 13 Feb 1942 B-Sqn 3rd King´s Own Hussars arrived at Oosthaven (SE tip of Sumatra also known as Pandjang) onboard transport ship HERMION. Disembarked 14 Feb. Reembarked 16 Feb on SILVER LATCH and a lighter towed by a tugboat. The tugboat with the lighter carrying 8 Tanks and 2 trucks sailed for Tandjoeng Priok in the evening 16 Feb. The rest of the Sqn sailed 17 Feb (SILVER LATCH?) from Oosthaven to Merak (NW tip of Java). In peacetime there was a railway ferry running between Oosthaven and Merak. There are pictures from Oosthaven 17 Feb AWM n:os 306789--306791 showing the Sqn embark. Anyhow the Sqn disembarked in Merak and moved by train to Batavia. A few stayed onboard the transport ship and sailed for Tandjoeng Priok. It is not stated if the vehicles were disembarked in Merak or if they stayed aboard the ship and sailed to Tandjoeng Priok. I think they sailed, since the railway from Merak to Batavia should have a limited capacity to freight tanks and other vehicles. If they however should be moved by rail, they should not have been taken to Tandjoeng Priok, wich is east of Batavia and that should be an ill selected place - already crowded by men and vehicles. So if the Humbers belonged to B-Sqn it fits in that they could be in Tandjoeng Priok on 19 Feb arriving by sea. And on 26th Feb they joined "Blackforce". So now it remains to find evidence that there were Humber ACs in the B-Sqn. Stellan
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Foxhole sends |
#9
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Hello Nuyt,
I see you had replied during the time I was writing my message above. Thanks! Yes, It makes sense. The Humbers on the pictures seems to be unarmed. The Japanese captured a number of 13,97 mm Boys AT-rifles made in Australia. I think that was the armament in the front hull of a Humber + a 7,7 mm Bren-gun in the turret. Is it possible to distinct a Mk II Humber from a Mk III on a picture? Is it known if Humbers were recaptured from the Japanese? Greetings, Stellan
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Foxhole sends |
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from what I can remember from my research (am at work right now) they were 4x2 MK III's.
I have never seen proof of survivors. Nuyt |
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#12
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The 49 MH ACs delivered to the KNIL were as I understand unarmed when they reached Java.
According to Kabbedijk (Stabelan nr 1/1987 p 41) those MHs were armed with 1-7,7 mm HMG Vickers .303 in the turret in abscense of a gun and 1-12,7 mm Anti-Aircraft MG Colt-Browning .50 on the turret. The AA MG should have been air-cooled. If this is right the 12,7 mm AA MG must have been such originally designed for aircraft. Same source states that there were only a few Overvalwagens of the Stadswacht type built on Chevrolet chassis by Droogdok Matschappij in Batavia. A larger number of the Braat type should have been built by Braat in Soerabaja and also by Droogdok Maatschappij (Naval drydock Co - a shipbuilder) in Batavia. Most of them on Chevrolet but also a few Ford chassis. At least one Overvalwagen was built by the Naval Dockyard in Soerabaja and armed with a 37 mm naval gun and a 12,7 mm AAMG. Stellan ADDED 3 July: I don´t really beleive that the AAMGs were 12,7 mm. I have only seen approx 1946 pictures of MHs, and they had what seems to be 7,7 mm AAMGs.
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Foxhole sends Last edited by Stellan Bojerud (RIP); 03-07-04 at 07:06. |
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In 1936 KNIL ordered 12 x Alvis-Straussler AC3D. These are well covered in the litterature. The first arrived 30 dec 1937.
But how were they armed? Most sources state: 1-12,7 mm HMG Colt-Browning water-cooled in the turret. 1-7,7 mm HMG Vickers water-cooled beside the driver. 1-7,7 mm AAMG Vickers carried inside the car which could be put on pivots to the right or the left of the turret. Was the AAMG water-cooled or air-cooled? But one source (Kabbedijk, Stabelan 1/1987 p 40) states that there was a second 7,7 mm Vickers water-cooled in the rear of the hull. So what is right? Did the AC3D have three or four MGs?
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Foxhole sends |
#14
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Possibly this is 2nd Cavalry Squadron (Cav 2) in Dec 1941 at Cav barracks in Bandoeng.
To the left: 1st AC Platoon (1 White Scoutcar outside the picture) 3 Alvis-Straussler, 1 Command car, 4 White´s = 4th HMG Plat). Middle row: 2nd Jeep Platoon (11 Jeep "Blitzbuggy"). Left row: 3rd Jeep Platoon.
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Foxhole sends |
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Aha! Thank you.
There are two possibilities: 1) They arrived with the Humbers. 2) They arrived with "Blackforce". But "Blackforce" had no MGs (were on another ship?), so why should they have AT-rifles? So I guess that they came with the Humbers. Stellan
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Foxhole sends |
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This post-WW 2 picture show a MH AC. The AAMG is not 12,7 mm but 7,7 mm.
I do doubt that 12,7 mm AAMGs were used on MH ACs.
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Foxhole sends |
#18
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A post-WW 2 picture of a MH tank - one of just 7 in service with the KNIL in 1942.
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Foxhole sends |
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