1974 Dodge D200 5/4 ton

[Jason Ginn]

Hi! I was wondering if anyone could help identify the original configuration for a truck I found recently.

The truck is an ex DND 1974 Dodge D200 4x4 with a manual transmission. The truck was painted olive drab and has patches of brush painted green on it as well.

There is evidence of a DND whoopie light on the roof and a large plate betwee the rear frame rails that once held a pintle hitch and trailer plug.

The truck was first registered in 1981 in Ottawa so it had a relatively short DND career.


I have seen one picture of a similar truck on the net that Ed Storey took but that is about it. That pic was taken from the front so I have no idea what the rear was configured for.

Basically I was wondering what these trucks were used for in Camoflage and why and how many were bought?

Thanks! J

I'll try and get pics up but I don't have a home computer and the forum hates I phones lol.

[Jason Ginn]

Here are the pics!

[Jason Ginn]

This is Ed Story's Pic that he put on another forum.

The caption states "1975 Dodge W200 1½ ton Truck 75-21853 ECC 142106*" . The pic was supposedly taken at CFB Rockliffe.

[maple_leaf_eh]

Jason:

In my youth, I watched a succession of light trucks come through 'the Pearly Gates' of the William Street Armoury. The Sherbrooke Hussars had M37 3/4s, which were getting pretty tired by 1976. Then there were Dodge 1 tons for the summer Olympics. These were followed by GM 5/4 tons maybe two years later. Certainly we had 5/4s by 1978.

I recall the Dodges weren't much help. For example, 12v systems meant no chance of mounting our tactical radios. The solution was to hang a manpack on the back racks and carry on. There was no SMP lighting or slave cable plug. The chrome trim wasn't very practical, and it probably was just painted over. I really don't remember. The 4wd was done with front locking hubs. The interior wasn't outfitted for any practical purposes. For some reason, I remember the bigger boys saying the bench seat was handy for entertaining girlfriends. All in all, the Dodge "Powerwagons" were a really interim step between proper military trucks, and the military needed reliable vehicles during the Montreal Olympics. Full stop.

[Ed Storey]

Here is a rear view of 21853 which was a 1975 D200. I can confirm the images were taken at Rockcliffe.

My records show that DND purchased 213 1974 Dodge D200 1 1/2 ton Trucks. I have photographs of D200s being used as both base and Reserve unit vehicles augmenting the Chevrolet 1 1/4 ton Trucks.

With a VIN I can provide the CFR for the vehicle.

[Jason Ginn]

Thanks Gents! Absolutely outstanding help!

Ed the VIN is W24BE4S143785

Thanks! Again!

[Frank v R]

I remember these trucks , they were all replaced in 1981 by the 1981 Chevy 1 tons 4x4 , 350 with a 4 speed stick, a buddy had one of the Dodges and I owned one of the Chevy 1 tons , both tough trucks the Dodge being more thirsty than the Chev. well Jason is there any hope for that Dodge?

[rob love]

My initial drivers course was on those Dodges along with the Deuce in 1978.

By what I saw, the Dodge Powerwagons were primarily a reserve truck. On replacing the 3/4 ton M37, a good portion of them may well have been used in the Olympics much as the M151A2s were....on the world stage they wanted us to look modern, and not driving 20 year old trucks.

Eventually when the chev 5/4 ton came out, they went to the regular army, while the reserves primarily got the Dodges. The reserves did get the odd 5/4 ton where they required a special platform such as the CPs or line trucks.

If memory serves, there was an ambulance version of the Dodge. While the bulk of the Dodge fleet was replaced by the chev 3/4 ton in 81, the ambulances remained in reserve at air force and militia units until eventually replace by the CUCV fleet around 1986. We still had a Dodge cargo converted into a tow truck when I was in Cypress in 89, but it was de-commisioned and replaced by a Hino that year. I personally removed a lot of the equipment like the Warn winch and moved it over to the Hino.

Funny thing was that while the reserves were getting fresh trucks every 6 or 7 years, the regular force milked along with the 76 5/4 tons from 1974 until almost 94/95. Of course, until the CUCV came along, the commercial trucks the militia used did not have 24 volt capability so things like a heater for the back or a radio could not be powered form the truck.

These commercial fleets were just a cheaper replacement rather than buying a full fleet of expensive SMP (yes, the chev 5.4 was considered a SMP) for both the regular and reserve forces. While that changed somewhat with the LSVW, the reserves did get their silverado milcots instead of G-wagons for the most part.

On a larger size, the same is done today where the International Defense MSVS was the militia replacement for the MLVW, and the regular force was supposed to get their true SMP replacement around the same time. However, with the almost decade long delay in replacing the MLVW, many of the MSVS have migrated over to the regular force to cover until the Mack/Volvos eventually get delivered (2017?)

[Ed Storey]

My records show that 64 D300 Ambulances were purchased in 1975.

[rob love]

A friend bought one of the surplus Dodge Ambulances. Extremely heavy duty truck with, I believe, a Dana 60 and Dana 70 axles. The regular force 5/4 tons always suffered from the light duty Dana 44 front axle, which was more suitable for a Jeep.

[Jason Ginn]

Vincent Tinguley posted these excellent pics on FB of the Dodge Ambulance in Cam!

[maple_leaf_eh]

It is possible Jason's truck is just an ordinary pickup used on base, by the Air Force or CE. Not necessarily green cam in the old days, but brushed on by Bubba long after leaving the service.

[rob love]

Generally a truck at an airforce base would have been the high visibility yellow with the low glare flat black hood. If it was a base truck, normally it would have been Lincoln commercial green. I worked on a lot of base vehicles back in the early 80s and they pretty much all followed this pattern.

I also saw where the militia would get issued a commercial truck as an administrative vehicle, and eventually out would come the paintbrush and cam paint. Certainly not authorized, but in those days of the soft skinned army ( and certainly true of the militia) somehow commercial vehicles became tactical.

[Jason Ginn]

A couple more "White Knights" the b&w shot is Vernon 1980 and the second is from a car listing.

[Robin Craig]

There was one of these Dodge truck floating around CFB Uplands by the maintenance folks and I only ever got a couple of shots of it, will have to find them. It was an oddity to me as it was gloss white with the DND crest on the doors and that van body on the back, it didn't know what it was.

I did ask some people about them but no one see to care.

A great find Jason.

[Jason Ginn]

Originally Posted by Frank v R

I remember these trucks , they were all replaced in 1981 by the 1981 Chevy 1 tons 4x4 , 350 with a 4 speed stick, a buddy had one of the Dodges and I owned one of the Chevy 1 tons , both tough trucks the Dodge being more thirsty than the Chev. well Jason is there any hope for that Dodge?

I hope there is Frank! I must admit that I wasn't looking for it but was looking at something else on the farm. The heavy chassis caught my eye and some snooping paid off!

If all goes well I will have it out of the dirt next week and we will be able to see if the frame is still intact. If so I think it might be saveable. The motor turns over and it was parked 5 years ago when a lock hub blew so fingers crossed!

I must admit it's kinda neat!

[Ed Storey]

Jason: Are you sure about the VIN, it does not match anything I have.

[Jason Ginn]

Originally Posted by Ed Storey

Jason: Are you sure about the VIN, it does not match anything I have.

HI! Is the format correct and just the last part different or is it a different format?

Have a pic of the door tag and the Registration paperwork and it matches. The truck has the DND Cloth tag on the sun visor. It sometimes has the CFR but it was written in blue pen is pretty faded.

I'll double check everything

[chris vickery]

Nice thing about old Dodge trucks is that your bodywork will be minimal. All the sheet metal is available in repro panels.
As long as the frame is good the rest is a piece of cake.
Mopar engines are still somewhat plentiful and easy to work on.
What was in these trucks for power? Small block/big block?

[Ed Storey]

Jason:

You have a lucky horseshoe as checking through my records a number of the CFRs associated with this vehicle bloc were reused as CF Shipping Containers in 1996, thankfully yours was not one of them.

All I know about the vehicle Dodge W200 W24BE4S143785 CFR 74-21640 ECC 142106 1 1/2 ton Cargo is that it was purchased in 1974 and disposed of out of Ottawa in Sept 1981.

This is a rare military vehicle that has received scant interest and is certainly worthy of being saved and restored as it is an excellent example of the transitional vehicles used by the Reserves and Regular Force in the 1970s and 1980s.

ED

[maple_leaf_eh]

Jason:

As what is now called, Commercial Off The Shelf (COTS), the Dodge will be easy to rebuild. With the VIN and other factory information, you will be able to determine the accessories and interior. As I recall it was a vinyl bench seat with a cut-out for the shifters. And a very basic 4x4 set at that. Front locking hubs painted over but still shiney underneath.

The tarp was canvas (as I recall) on a 5/8" steel tube frame. The examples already posted will give you the idea. It probably had oak slat bench seats the full length down each side. Whether there were seat belts is anyone's guess!

I have one memory of the Sherbrooke Hussars' Dodge One-Ton, and that is the smell of clutch plates as it towed a broken down M38A1 Jeep back into the drill hall. It is a 90-deg turn uphill across traffic into a narrow double door. (Google Streetview does not do the slope and sharpness any justice.)

[charlie fitton]

[QUOTE=rob love;229999].....Certainly not authorized, but in those days of the soft skinned army ( and certainly true of the militia)......


Au Contrare Rob... We had orders from on high to cam everything, and were given about a week to do it.

Here's a mimeographed drawing, a bit of chalk, brushes and paint..get at it.

We even had a rubbery white to cover the flat black in the winter. Blew off on the highway like a great big balloon. That wasn't done twice.

[Jason Ginn]

That is outstanding Ed! Thank you so much!


I love hearing the memories of these trucks it seems sometimes the most basic this stick with us as memorable!

I hope to be able to save the old beast it looks pretty good all this gs considered.

Chis, the motor is a 318 2 barrel. No wonder they were hard on gas!

The interior is very much hunter green with OD floors and kick panes roof etc. The seat is part paisley embossed but the base is ton. It seems I can get NOS replacements from the M880 US dodges but they are only avail in black. Possibly a dye job could correct them. Otherwise the commerial repro examples don't have the paisley pattern.

I ran the vin through a dodge website and interestingly it identified the trim line on the truck as "Royal Sportsman"!

[rob love]

[QUOTE=charlie fitton;230078]

Originally Posted by rob love

.....Certainly not authorized, but in those days of the soft skinned army ( and certainly true of the militia)......


Au Contrare Rob... We had orders from on high to cam everything, and were given about a week to do it.

Here's a mimeographed drawing, a bit of chalk, brushes and paint..get at it.

We even had a rubbery white to cover the flat black in the winter. Blew off on the highway like a great big balloon. That wasn't done twice.

I remember that white stuff. You couldn't keep it on, then when you tried to remove the rest you couldn't get it off. So you painted over it again.

I agree that orders were given to cam the field vehicles, but when the brushes started going over the panel van or the white crew cab, they were going too far. s well, I am speaking of the late 70s/early to mid 80s when some of these transgressions occurred.

[chris vickery]

Cummings re-power?
If interested in this as an option, keep an eye out for an early 12v with a 5 speed transmission. The early Cummins were all mechanical so really simple to do an engine swap.

[rob love]

Cummins require the heavy heavy diffs, and heavy heavy front suspension. While these dodges were fairly heavy, I'm not certain they were that heavy.

Besides, fuel is still cheap for a little while yet, so feed that 318.

[chris vickery]

I looked at a Cummins re-power for my M715 when I had it.
The recommended refit was to go with 14bolt corporate and Dana 60 from a CUCV. As you point out, maybe the 5/4 Dodge is not up to task... What diffs are in that? Dana 60/70?

[Jason Ginn]

The Diffs are listed as D44and D60 respectivley. I think a 12v that was anything but stock would be hard on the front. Especially the Warn lockers.

I like the old 318 and it's not like I would ever need it for commuting!


I think I'll try an ATIP for the truck. See if it ever went outside ASU Ottawa.

[rob love]

Originally Posted by Jason Ginn

The Diffs are listed as D44and D60 respectivley. I think a 12v that was anything but stock would be hard on the front. Especially the Warn lockers.

I like the old 318 and it's not like I would ever need it for commuting!


I think I'll try an ATIP for the truck. See if it ever went outside ASU Ottawa.

A dana 44 is really at it's limits with the 318.

Good luck on the ATIP. We have tried to recover the old Loomis data for the museum, but it would seem to have suffered the fate of the delete button last summer when the DND shuffled around the defense websites. .

[Jason Ginn]

Well I was surfing Kijiji tonight and tripped across a Dodge Ambulance Body for sale in NS!

No I don't want it, and no connection etc. But I thought the pics were great as they are the ony ones I've seen of the rear showing the bumper and closed doors.