Ford Blitz Restoration/Rebuild

[hrpearce]

Originally Posted by Private_collector

Despite all the pleading and begging of emergency services, there are soooo many people who take the risk still.

Unfortunately there is no law against stupidity

[Private_collector]

Hey Robert,

There is a law against stupidity.

It's the law of natural selection

[Ian Johns]

Here's the old girl (future project) 1943 Cab 13. The front spring bracket is different then yours. It has the extra hook on the bottom. Has anybody have any ideas why?

[Keith Webb]

Originally Posted by Ian Johns

Here's the old girl (future project) 1943 Cab 13. The front spring bracket is different then yours. It has the extra hook on the bottom. Has anybody have any ideas why?

That is a very late production modification, I've only seen a couple like that here in Australia. I would imagine it would have something to do with anchoring a vehicle either for shipping or winching.

Does yours also have a different to standard gearbox cross member? One of those I saw with that type of spring hangar also had a F15 type cross member rather than the one where the gearbox bolts into it.

[Ian Johns]

Thanks for the info. When I get home tonight I'll check and see if I have any photos. If not when the snow melts a little I'll get in and crawl under her.

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Keith Webb

I would imagine it would have something to do with anchoring a vehicle either for shipping or winching.

Keith, I'm certain it's for winching, I distinctly recall seeing a diagram when we were kids, showing the use of scotches on a Cab 13 FAT. A chain (or cable) is attached to the scotch plate under the rear wheel and hooked onto the spring hanger, anchoring the vehicle for winching forwards. A similar arrangement was shown for winching rearwards, with the scotch plate under the front wheel, but I can't remember where the other end of the cable was hooked onto.

I always thought it was rather clever - the scotch plate has a "spade" underneath, which is forced into the ground as the vehicle is driven over it until the chain is taut.

As you say Keith it must have been a very late mod, because they're extremely rare to find. Here's one on a wrecked chassis I came across a while back.

[Bob Carriere]

...are illustration of how the scotches where tied to the truck in a fashion that allowed the wheels to be dragged over than held in place by the chain... it also shows where they were tied bu that may have been only for CGT...

I must admit I have never seen that extra hook on the front spring hanger.

Phil Waterman has a set of scotches and may actually have used them with his C60 cab 12 w/w.

There was a guy in Ontario, wine country, that had a whole bunch of wooden crates..... 4 scotches to a crate..... lucky to get a few before they went to the scrap heap as no else wanted them.

Bob

[Ian Johns]

Originally Posted by Private_collector

Sure, I would be happy to come help. It'll cost only an airfare and a CMP fuel/water tank.

Seriously, I will keep my eyes open for something similar to your tank. I like the look of a tank on a blitz. Wonder if I could slice one in half horazontally, and make it hinge open to be a campervan! Not a genuine one of course, modern equiv.

If you find the 350 gallon tank it will give you a little more room to stretch out.

[hrpearce]

Originally Posted by Keith Webb

That is a very late production modification, I've only seen a couple like that here in Australia. I would imagine it would have something to do with anchoring a vehicle either for shipping or winching.

Does yours also have a different to standard gearbox cross member? One of those I saw with that type of spring hangar also had a F15 type cross member rather than the one where the gearbox bolts into it.

The hooks are for winching. Page 31in driver's handbook for chevrolet 1945 describes the scotching methods. My father in law said they worked well until the winching became dificult and if you didn't stop in time you snaped the U bolts on the scotched axle.

[Private_collector]

Yay! Finally got a copy of the Blueprint for Victory book.



New tie rod joint boots arrived yesterday too. They are a great fit, and will take the original spring and disks from the old ones.

I took my set of CNC files for a Browning 50 cal MG to the local metal fabrication shop. Awaiting price for cutting all the flat pieces. All other bits I will have to make myself. That will be interesting. No idea what to expect for $$$ of CNC cutting.

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by hrpearce

if you didn't stop in time you snaped the U bolts on the scotched axle.

Perhaps that's why they introduced the hooked spring hanger. All the force is taken by the chain, there's no force whatsoever on the axle.

[Phil Waterman]

Hi Guys

First I don't think the hook incorporated into the spring shackle was intended for use with the winch or winch scotches it is to lightly built. The U attachments for the scotches are much much heavier 3/4 to 1" diameter and they need to be.

I've attached the scotches drawing from the hand book as well as some pictures of the scotches on my truck. The pictures with the cables were taken when I was getting the correct length. Since then I've had heavy cable with loops made. Strangely because of the placement of the frame hooks the cable chain combo need to be different lengths depending on you are put them under front or rear wheels.

I've used the winch and scotches a lot for pulling very large trees up hill. The winch unit is amazingly power full and deserves respect. When you put the scotches down on the ground and hook them to the frame hooks and move the truck wheels up on them and then start pulling, because of the scotch angles they dig right into the ground until flush.

Now to the wheel flanges the explanation I was that they were primarily to speed ship loading and unloading using a pair of spreader bars equipped with loop ends a crane crew could very quickly have a truck read to lift. The other use of course is using two ropes they can be used like a capstan winch to pull a vehicle out being stuck. But if there was mud involved I'd drag at the regular winch cable first.

Cheers Phil

[Private_collector]

These are the replacement tie rod boots I was talking about.

They are diffferent profile to original, but are a very good fit. The upper hole is quite snug through the tie rod bolt end, but will make for a good tight fit and sits really well. Using the original spring keeps the boot pressed to both surfaces. Just need to remove the short right-angled end piece (about 8mm long) on bottom end of the spring. I had already removed those before I took these photos, sorry. The two metal discs are from the original boot. One goes inside bottom of new boot, below the spring.

The boots courtesy of ebay at cost of $5.95 pair, from this seller in AUS: http://stores.ebay.com.au/suzukisupe...id=p4340.l2563

Part identification No: TE 8

Specs as per following photo.

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Phil Waterman

I've attached the scotches drawing from the hand book

Yes, this is similar to the FAT diagram I recall, although not quite as detailed. Note low position of front cable attachment point - well below the chassis rail, in the vicinity of the spring hanger. This is necessary to avoid fouling the step brackets, petrol tank and brackets (esp. longer FAT petrol tank), and battery box on RHS. This can be demonstrated by running a string line from under the rear wheel to ANY point on the chassis rail itself where a hook might be mounted. It may just be possible on the LHS of 60S and 60L CMPs, but definitely not possible on the RHS. I'm left to conclude that winching forward with scotches was not possible before the hooked spring hanger mod. Any thoughts....?

As Phil says the hook is not large in cross-section, being merely an extension of the ribbed reinforcement part of the spring hanger, which is barely 3/8" thick. However it's of considerable depth along the line of force, and a thick stiffener pad has been added in the casting. In order to fail it would have to shear through a large area of metal, something along the lines shown in pic 5 perhaps.

There would of course be a component of sideways force, since the scotch plates are outboard of the spring hangers, and this would be greatest with the FAT, due to the greater angle resulting from SWB. All in all though I reckon it would be plenty strong enough for a CMP winch, which are only rated at 7000 lbs. However I guess we'll never know, unless perhaps Ian will be kind enough to test his to destruction for us!

[Ian Johns]

Originally Posted by Tony Wheeler

Yes, this is similar to the FAT diagram I recall, although not quite as detailed. Note low position of front cable attachment point - well below the chassis rail, in the vicinity of the spring hanger. This is necessary to avoid fouling the step brackets, petrol tank and brackets (esp. longer FAT petrol tank), and battery box on RHS. This can be demonstrated by running a string line from under the rear wheel to ANY point on the chassis rail itself where a hook might be mounted. It may just be possible on the LHS of 60S and 60L CMPs, but definitely not possible on the RHS. I'm left to conclude that winching forward with scotches was not possible before the hooked spring hanger mod. Any thoughts....?

As Phil says the hook is not large in cross-section, being merely an extension of the ribbed reinforcement part of the spring hanger, which is barely 3/8" thick. However it's of considerable depth along the line of force, and a thick stiffener pad has been added in the casting. In order to fail it would have to shear through a large area of metal, something along the lines shown in pic 5 perhaps.

There would of course be a component of sideways force, since the scotch plates are outboard of the spring hangers, and this would be greatest with the FAT, due to the greater angle resulting from SWB. All in all though I reckon it would be plenty strong enough for a CMP winch, which are only rated at 7000 lbs. However I guess we'll never know, unless perhaps Ian will be kind enough to test his to destruction for us!

LOL I'll pass on it this time. Maybe later?

[Jacques Reed]

Originally Posted by Private_collector

These are the replacement tie rod boots I was talking about.
goes inside bottom of new boot, below the spring.

The boots courtesy of ebay at cost of $5.95 pair, from this seller in AUS: http://stores.ebay.com.au/suzukisupe...id=p4340.l2563

Part identification No: TE 8

Specs as per following photo.
Attachment 55076

Hi Tony,

Many thanks for that info. If it does the job, looks reasonable, and doesn't cost the earth they will do me! Bit like my modified rubber gearshift boot a few weeks back.

Cheers

[Private_collector]

That reminds me. I also bought a gear shift boot a couple of days ago from UK.
From memory, I think it is off a 70s Cortina or escort.
At least it's from a Ford, and looks to have the potential for me to modify bottom section to fit the opening.

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Phil Waterman

Now to the wheel flanges the explanation I was that they were primarily to speed ship loading and unloading using a pair of spreader bars equipped with loop ends a crane crew could very quickly have a truck read to lift. The other use of course is using two ropes they can be used like a capstan winch to pull a vehicle out being stuck. But if there was mud involved I'd drag at the regular winch cable first.

Pic 1 shows the ship loading arrangement Phil describes, but prior to the introduction of flanged hubs. It can be seen just how much simpler and faster it would be with flanged hubs. Personally I have no doubt they were designed expressly for this purpose. I wonder if they were part of D-Day planning...? They appeared in Australia around late '44 as standard equipment.

I've often heard the capstan winch suggestion, but I've always dismissed it as pure speculation arising from the shape of the front hub, which resembles a miniature ship's capstan. It strikes me as entirely impractical, if not impossible. Has anyone ever tried it? If not, it might be a worthwhile exercise one day, to prove the point one way or the other. Perhaps we can get MythBusters to tackle it!

[Private_collector]

On Saturday morning, the pintle parts and front bumper brackets were painted. Pintle was assembled/installed later that afternoon. Yep, the paint dries that quick! So quick that I could wrap a rag around the middle of the pintle spring, attach a loop of chain, and hold it in place with the engine hoist, while I put the second pintle bracket in place.

I took the liberty of adding a thin strip of rubber to the pintle brackets, to stop the spring from rattling around.

Finally got all the old spring clamps off front spring sets.Then gave em a really good cleaning, ready for the sandblasters tomorrow.

As predicted (no, really!), the rain has started to move in again, and jungle drums say lots more rain coming tomorrow and Tuesday. Wonderful news.
Got begger-all done on front axle and steering. Due to weight, that's an outside job only. At least until I get the steering knuckles off. So that means an impromptu 'replacement' job done today.

And that job was to make a new reverse select latch for the gear shift. I have three gearboxes, and none have a latch that's in one piece. One was, until a friend 'helped' me unload it when I got it home, and allowed the thing to fall onto the latch, squashing and breaking it!

[Private_collector]

The final job for the day was to disassemble & clean the trans shift tower. This was frozen when I got it, and I discovered today that it was dues to an accumulation of dirt and other muck in the selector travel tubes. That's all gone now.

When I got the selectors out, I found one of the three plunger ball springs was corroded and broke in two upon removal. Checking through Macs catalog for replacements.

[Private_collector]

Unbelievable! The heavy rains have resulted in yet MORE flooding in Gympie. Levels expected to get to 18 metres above normal Mary river height. That means most of the businesses evacuated then flood damaged in the January flood, will be receiving the same again now. Here at home, 40km north of town, we have had over 250mm in past 36 hours. That's roughly 10 inches.

I've had the CMP front springs in back of the car since Sunday, but cannot get them to the sandblaster as all roads there are presently under water. Don't think I can get there until at least Thursday or later.

I don't expect to hear from the metal shop regarding having CNC work for a replica 50 cal either. They are amongst the first businesses to get flooded and have had to evacuate their premises for second time in a month. Fairly certain they have more important things on their mind, other than quoting.

On a positive note, my front brake shoes have arrived, and will do just fine. Also won an auction for a genuine WWII Ford 6 point junction block. Been looking for one for a number of weeks and now that has payed off.

[Ryan]

Good luck to you and all those other poor buggers up there getting a soaking Tony.

Just give me 10% of what your getting though will you!? Only 6mm of rain for feb so far down here.

[Little Jo]

[QUOTE=Private_collector;176591]Unbelievable! The heavy rains have resulted in yet MORE flooding in Gympie. Levels expected to get to 18 metres above normal Mary river height. That means most of the businesses evacuated then flood damaged in the January flood, will be receiving the same again now. Here at home, 40km north of town, we have had over 250mm in past 36 hours. That's roughly 10 inches.

Hi Tony

I feel for you people up there in Queensland, I hope you survive OK without any damage. I see on the news tonight a cyclone off Pt Headlands in WA, We here is SA could surely do with some rain, all we get is heat and drought, so don't be greedy share some of the rain with us.

Cheers

Tony

[Tony Wheeler]

Originally Posted by Ryan

Good luck to you and all those other poor buggers up there getting a soaking Tony.

Yes, I feel for them too, it must be heartbreaking to go through this yet again. Seems they built Gympie in the wrong place, time to move to higher ground when you find yourself cohabiting with fish.

[Private_collector]

I agree, Gympie was not built with flood mitigation in mind.

Like a lot of gold mining towns, Gympie evolved around the mines themselves, with little thought for the future. We still get the occasional collapse of an ancient mine shaft, resulting in a sink hole. I think the last one appeared in the middle of a road. This has happened in peoples backyards too. All the current rain may contribute to future sink holes.

[cliff]

we got some damp inside this time as the overland flow water down the hill behind us banked up against the rear wall of our house and entered through the weepholes in the brick cladding. Not bad but we need a week of sunshine to properly dry out. Forecasters are promising more rain next week

[Private_collector]

Guess that's one promise you would be happy for them to break, eh Cliff!

This time the water is going down VERY slowly. Rain continues off & on, to the extent that the river is getting a little top-up, slowing draining of flood waters.

Buy the way Tony W, that wasn't a fish. Just a tadpole. Frogs grow real big up this way
That's how we lost our cat, you know.

[Private_collector]

Called into the upholstery shop this afternoon. The new mud flaps are finished and they look really good. Only one of the two guys was there at work, the other fellow was kept away by flooding, on the other side of town. The chap that I spoke to said I could take the flaps with me, but he couldn't take the money at the time, because he wasn't the one who does the costing. I chose to leave em there until they are paid for. That will be after the water goes down again, which might be Friday. I'll post a couple of pics when I pick them up.

Now I need to make a second, shorter, pair for the front. I had originally thought front ones were the length that I made the current ones, but that does not seem to be the case.

[Private_collector]

These are the fresh mud flaps. I still need to put the eyelets into bolt holes, but that can wait till I get around to it.

It's about time for me to start assembling some of the new bits that will be needed for the engine rebuild (not my job ). There are many Ford flathead water pumps for sale, but most are single pulley. I don't suppose it is a simple task to remove single and substitute double pulley on the same water pump, is it?

A google search has not been helpful in identifying any businesses nearby (~200km will do) that can do chemical stripping of engine block and heads. Not greatly concerned about this just now. The first thing that needs to occur is the successful removal of engine parts, while keeping each one labelled as to point of origin and orientation. I would be fairly safe in saying I will need at least 2 new cylinder sleeves. Two of the originals have a fair bit of pitting, and i'm not keen on oversizing to extent that would be required.

[Keith Webb]

I'm fairly sure they are a different beast to the single pulley ones with different housings and bearings.