RCAF Station Carberry, Manitoba

[David Dunlop]

Darrell: Interesting photos from Pennfield. I have never seen that long concrete wall feature before, and have no idea what it's purpose. Be interesting to see what other wartime airfields in Canada had that feature and what training took place at them. Maybe that would show a 'common denominator' and explain it all. RCAF Station Virden, here in Manitoba was a BCATP site for primary flight training and was built as a grass field facility. The only concrete was the ramp area and around the hanger line and it never had a gun butt. I would lean towards them being built on an 'as needed' basis. I will check my Manitoba airfield air photo collection and see what shows up.

Marc: One of the mysteries with these gun butts is how little damage they all show on the face of the concrete. One would expect that with dozens of aircraft having their guns sited in over the years, you would find some form of wear pattern. Wartime .303 ball ammunition has a very heavy jacket on it, compared with the modern military ammunition of today. It would take it's toll on the concrete over time. One would also think the shrapnel created would be a hazard sooner or later. More than one weapons tech probably had bits of jacket whizzing past their heads!


David

[rob love]

Targets were set up in line with the sand which was piled against the butt. You did not shoot at the walls...that would be bad. The cement was only to catch strays.

Records were kept of how many rounds are expended into the sand, and when it reaches a certain point the sand is changed, otherwise you would eventually have ricochets from the bullets in the sand.

[David Dunlop]

Thanks for that, Rob. Makes a lot of sense, and on reflection, I recall seeing a video of a Hurricane somewhere having it's guns sited in. There was a jack stand set up under the rear fuselage to level the plane and I think sand bags up against the wall about six feet or so. And there was some sort of 'paper target' setup. Reminded me a bit at the time of the targets that used to be used in service stations many years ago to aim headlights on vehicles.

The storage sheds in back of the butts probably held all the equipment needed for the siting process.

Have you ever run across those long concrete walls at any of the old bases here on the prairies? The old Gunnery Range at Langruth had a long curved earth berm running from the old admin site by the original gate at the highway, up to the SE Range Control Tower, and that was likely to protect people/vehicles in transit to the tower while the range was active.

David

[rob love]

The berms I am talking about were for small arms and pistols. They usually had a wooden hut that you shot out of. No place for an aircraft. Nowadays you still see the cement berm, but the huts are usually long gone.

You mentioned Virden.....I thought I saw the Berm there. I pass by that old base once and a while to some of the local shooting matches. They just recently tore down the hanger. I'll have a look for the berm next time I am by.

Edited to add: Just had a look on google satellite and sure enough, there is/was the pistol range berm at the Virden site. It shows on the aerial view, but is a pile of rubble on the street view.

[Marc Montgomery]

Now that you mention it, I wonder if the wall and (overgrown) dirt/sand in front, were for pistols and rifles, not aircraft mg...can't think why they would have mg siting at St Kitts? I was very young at the time so size ,distance from other buildings etc are fuzzy.

[r.morrison]

I just got off the phone with Henry Hill of Burnaby B.C. A navigator in a Halifax Bomber during WW11, Henry always comes with our group when we do parades and stands proudly in the trucks waving to the crowds. Anyway, we were talking of current books we're reading and it turns out we are both reading books from the same author (Mark Zuehlke). Somehow during the conversation Henry mentioned Carberry Manitoba and I had mentioned to him David's thread on the subject. Turns out that Henry was stationed there or did business there after the war (not sure of the years). And yes....he does remember the airport, or parts of, being sold off to a "potato farmer" by the name of Simplot. And David....he only paid $100.00 for the whole shootin' match!!
But he also remembers a flight of 14 to 16 P51 Mustangs flying into this airport and being parked along the edge of the runways. And they were put up for sale. Price (fasten seat belt!) $1000.00 each. An American bought up pretty well the whole lot, as he knew a deal when he saw it.
So it is...from the horse's mouth so to speak. If you have any other questions re Carberry, let me know. I'll be seeing Henry and his wife Christmas Eve. Cheers.....Robert